Should we be Sellers?

[ChoppedWood]

Originally Posted by ChaosTheory

You're shooting for us being the '22 Jaguars? And you want to sell some of our best players and our GM to do it?

Sell our GM? No, fire our GM.

This team is fucked. There is NO heart on this team, there is NO grit, this is a candy ass collection of entitled rich dudes collecting checks and nothing more---- ALL of this produced by Ballard mind you. This is HIS culture, this is what he cultivated with his incredible ability to "read the room" and find the right guys from a fit perspective--- a team that couldn't even beat the WORST team in the league that NEEDED TO LOSE!

Saturday spoke to sweeping changes if he gets the nod, and I would expect that would mean a bunch of prima-donna's getting pink slips or in reality, getting shipped for a bag of chips to get rid of their piss poor effort / attitude.

Yes, the 22 Jags, a shit show of an organization that is growing behind a lot of young guys including a young QB. And most notably, a coach that has rebuilt a culture that was a malignant mess just a year ago. That is NOT happening with a bunch of these dudes here doing the same fucking thing next year as they did this year which is every bit Ballard's team!

[Dam8610]

Originally Posted by ChoppedWood

Sell our GM? No, fire our GM.

This team is fucked. There is NO heart on this team, there is NO grit, this is a candy ass collection of entitled rich dudes collecting checks and nothing more---- ALL of this produced by Ballard mind you. This is HIS culture, this is what he cultivated with his incredible ability to "read the room" and find the right guys from a fit perspective--- a team that couldn't even beat the WORST team in the league that NEEDED TO LOSE!

Saturday spoke to sweeping changes if he gets the nod, and I would expect that would mean a bunch of prima-donna's getting pink slips or in reality, getting shipped for a bag of chips to get rid of their piss poor effort / attitude.

Yes, the 22 Jags, a shit show of an organization that is growing behind a lot of young guys including a young QB. And most notably, a coach that has rebuilt a culture that was a malignant mess just a year ago. That is NOT happening with a bunch of these dudes here doing the same fucking thing next year as they did this year which is every bit Ballard's team!

You point at the Jaguars as an example to say that it will take more than getting rid of a head coach to change the culture? The Jaguars are the example of just the opposite of that.

[JAFF]

Originally Posted by Luck4Reich

Who says Sam isn't a big upgrade over Ryan and Wentz?

I for one will wait and see what he does first.

He is what he is. Smart, average arm, medium accuracy, good feet, and to get him space to run pass plays he needs to roll out.

He is limited. The interception in the final game were BAD throws, bad decisions. Start him next year, the team wont get above 8 wins, even with the entire D comes back healthy.

[ChoppedWood]

Originally Posted by Dam8610

You point at the Jaguars as an example to say that it will take more than getting rid of a head coach to change the culture? The Jaguars are the example of just the opposite of that.

Yes, there is certainly some conflicting inference, no question. Nothing is ever quite so tidy and clear cut as you would want it to be, and thus a lot of the reason we use comparisons.

Obviously my view is this environment is straight up shit. We got rid of the coach, who I assign the greatest amount of blame to, and really, nothing changed. My belief from some of the things I have heard / read is that Frank didn't hold anyone to account for much of anything, and that Saturday has TRIED to change that but not had much success in doing so, and if so, then there would seem to be a problem beyond the coaching position(s).

With that said, I look beyond the coaching chair to the GM- he has been here 5 years, set the coach aside, these are HIS guys. He has been lauded for his focus on college captains, on his focus on character, blah blah blah. Well using wins as a measure, Chris Ballard has SUCKED at his job. To me, if these are his guys then this is a culture that traces back to him and one that has to be eliminated in order for us to turn this thing around.

So fine, don't use the 22' Jags, use whatever you want as a barometer, measuring against nearly every other barometer, this organization loses. I would like to say the Commanders are a worse organization, but with a ton of chaos, an owner that is mired in controversy, saddled with an even more F'd up QB situation than ours, that team managed to go 8-8-1 and barely missed the playoffs. Panthers, very similar, Jets to some degree similar, both appear to be in a better situation than us. Perhaps the Browns are worse than us, but they at least took a shot at landing a QB that can transform the organization. The Texans- yeah they are pretty shitty too. Great so our measuring stick is the fucking Texans, and yet somehow, in Ballard we trust?

No, get rid of him and everything that he has ever touched and try to rebuild with a new culture and a new set of dude's that aren't comfortable sucking.

[JAFF]

Originally Posted by ChoppedWood

The Texans- yeah they are pretty shitty too. Great so our measuring stick is the fucking Texans, and yet somehow, in Ballard we trust?

No, get rid of him and everything that he has ever touched and try to rebuild with a new culture and a new set of dude's that aren't comfortable sucking.

Impractical and impossible. You can dump every contract without salary cap consequences which would keep a team from having enough money to sign the next years draftees let alone 53 players.

There are guys on the roster who need to see the door, but not “everything that he has ever touched”, its unrealistic.

[ChoppedWood]

Originally Posted by JAFF

Impractical and impossible. You can dump every contract without salary cap consequences which would keep a team from having enough money to sign the next years draftees let alone 53 players.

There are guys on the roster who need to see the door, but not “everything that he has ever touched”, its unrealistic.

Hyperbolic of course, yes there are dudes that he has brought in that you keep because they are good players and have the right attitude- I think that could be said about EVERY GM in the NFL. But looking at the landscape, he seems to have failed to do it at a consistently high level.

Clearly blaming Wentz, scapegoating Ryan, laughing at Sam, that's smoke and mirrors. There's something far more F'd up with this place than just the QB position. But then again, if not and you lay it all at the hands of the QB and the shitty OL- well the only other person you can blame if you ascribe to the GM being in charge of personnel- is Chris Ballard.

To me, he is a cultural thing at this point, his staying in some respects excuses the shitty culture that sees us losing in comical context, becoming a laughing stock in the NFL, and in my view, likely perpetuates it going forward. Sometimes you have no choice but to reject everything about the current in order to succeed in the future, to me, that means he needs to be fired.

[rm1369]

Originally Posted by ChoppedWood

Hyperbolic of course, yes there are dudes that he has brought in that you keep because they are good players and have the right attitude- I think that could be said about EVERY GM in the NFL. But looking at the landscape, he seems to have failed to do it at a consistently high level.

Clearly blaming Wentz, scapegoating Ryan, laughing at Sam, that's smoke and mirrors. There's something far more F'd up with this place than just the QB position. But then again, if not and you lay it all at the hands of the QB and the shitty OL- well the only other person you can blame if you ascribe to the GM being in charge of personnel- is Chris Ballard.

To me, he is a cultural thing at this point, his staying in some respects excuses the shitty culture that sees us losing in comical context, becoming a laughing stock in the NFL, and in my view, likely perpetuates it going forward. Sometimes you have no choice but to reject everything about the current in order to succeed in the future, to me, that means he needs to be fired.

I believe the cultural issue is primarily created by Ballard’s consistent focus on the future, intentional gifting of positions to his draft picks, and the constant QB carousel. He has never went into a season where he made moves that would indicate “this is the year”. Every single year there are holes that are left clearly for development. If fans recognize it, you can damn sure bet players recognize it. Throw in shit like low balling Autry and always needing to win on a contract (other than with his draft picks of course)and a new QB every year while they hope to get lucky at the position, and it’s a shit culture that isn’t actually focused on winning games. That’s from Ballard down. Culture won’t change until Ballard is gone or forced to try to win games NOW instead of next year. His philosophy has been shit and this is the obvious result of it.

[rcubed]

ballard has made his mistakes personnel wise, but blaming the culture on "his guys" is a bit unfair imo. that culture was cultivated by reich and bled down into the team. thats why we need to get a coach that will come in and not coddle the players, whoop some ass, and put some determination behind the team. I think saturday has that attitude, but I still dont want him as HC.

[rm1369]

Originally Posted by rcubed

ballard has made his mistakes personnel wise, but blaming the culture on "his guys" is a bit unfair imo. that culture was cultivated by reich and bled down into the team. thats why we need to get a coach that will come in and not coddle the players, whoop some ass, and put some determination behind the team. I think saturday has that attitude, but I still dont want him as HC.

I’m personally not blaming it on “his guys”, I’m blaming it on him. As a fan I knew when they signed Rivers but did shit in the off-season at WR (and other positions) that they weren’t going “all in” to win with Rivers. He was simply a place holder. When they started last year with no DE on the roster with double digit sacks for their CAREER and they let Autry walk to a rival over peanuts, I knew as a fan they were more focused on future development at DE than they were on actually winning games. This off-season when their moves on the OL consisted of signing a journeyman guard at LT and drafting a 3rd round LT it was obvious there was again a focus on future development at LT over winning NOW. Same with the gift of RG to Pinter. There has been a clear method to Ballard’s roster building. One that focuses on development of his draft picks over winning now. I’m not sure how that is even arguable. And if you don’t think that is noticed in the locker room I think you are crazy. As a fan I’m pissed. If I was someone like Buckner I’d be fucking livid.

If everything else in the building is fine and you need a yeller and a screamer to motivate your players, you have the wrong fucking players. But everything else in the building isn’t fine. Ballard has yet to prioritize winning over building. And that makes everything else rotten.

[YDFL Commish]

Back to the OP, if you got season tickets and wanna sell them, let's talk.