Free Agents Discussion

[smitty46953]

NFL Network‏Verified account @nflnetwork · 5m5 minutes ago
LB Jarvis Jones is expected to sign with the @AZCardinals.


:cool:

[smitty46953]

Ian Rapoport‏Verified account @RapSheet · 3h3 hours ago

For the #Seahawks and RB Eddie Lacy, it's: 1 year, $5.55M with $3M fully guaranteed.

:cool:

[omahacolt]

Ian Rapoport‏Verified account @RapSheet · 3h3 hours ago

For the #Seahawks and RB Eddie Lacy, it's: 1 year, $5.55M with $3M fully guaranteed.

:cool:

I heard the dude weighed in at 267 lbs

[smitty46953]

I heard the dude weighed in at 267 lbs

Yes I heard same thing. Also heard Pete Carroll said he wants him big with playing weight of 240+ ... :cool:

[Maniac]

I heard the dude weighed in at 267 lbs

He is on the Jamarcus Russell diet.

[Brylok]

Simon seems like the best addition so far. Filling holes and creating competition is good, but I'd like to see at least one established defensive playmaker added. They have/had $50 million available.

[apballin]

Simon seems like the best addition so far. Filling holes and creating competition is good, but I'd like to see at least one established defensive playmaker added. They have/had $50 million available.

Name 1 specific guy because otherthan Poe or Berry there wasn't any playmakers available

[Puck]

Name 1 specific guy because otherthan Poe or Berry there wasn't any playmakers available


Bouye
Gilmore
Williams
Campbell

[VeveJones007]

Simon seems like the best addition so far. Filling holes and creating competition is good, but I'd like to see at least one established defensive playmaker added. They have/had $50 million available.

This has been my biggest complaint of the last five years. When you have that much cap space and Mike Adams is the biggest playmaker you bring in, you've failed.

[Dam8610]

Bouye
Gilmore
Williams
Campbell

50% correct. Bouye and Campbell fit the bill.

[ukcolt]

Campbell is not a long term solution, he might give you a couple of years decent service. But in my eyes he is not an elite defensive lineman, decent yeah, but likely to decline due to age.

[Wyatt]

@ProFootballTalk 5m5 minutes ago
Dontari Poe takes his free agent tour to Miami

[sherck]

Day 7:

From NFL.com Top 101 Free Agents:

#04 ILB Dont'a Hightower, NE
#08 RB Adrian Peterson, MIN
#10 NT Dontari Poe, KC
#11 DT Johnathan Hankins, NYG
#18 FS T.J. McDonald, LAR
#20 ILB Zach Brown, BUF
#34 TE Jared Cook, GB
#35 QB Jay Cutler, CHI
#37 WR Michael Floyd, NE
#39 ILB Kevin Minter, ARI
#42 RB Jamaal Charles, KC
#44 CB Morris Claiborne, DAL
#50 DE Jared Odrick, JAX
#52 RB Latavius Murray, OAK
#54 QB Brandon Carr, DAL
#56 RB LeGarrette Blount, NE
#57 DE Mario Williams, MIA
#60 DE Dwight Freeney, ATL
#63 SS Bradley McDougald, TB
#66 OC Nick Mangold, NYJ
#75 OT Ryan Clady, NYJ
#76 QB Colin Kaepernick, SF
#79 QB Ryan Fitzpatrick, NYJ
#81 OG D.J. Fluker, LAC
#84 OLB Erik Walden, IND
#86 QB Geno Smith, NYJ
#89 RB Christian Michael, GB
#90 RB DeAngelo Williams, PIT
#91 DE Devin Taylor, DET
#94 CB Nickell Robey-Coleman, BUF
#97 DE Chris Long, NE
#98 SS Jarius Byrd, NO
#100 CB/S Darius Butler, IND

3 ILB on that list (Hightower, Brown, Minter) and I would add Gerald Hodges, SF, to that list as being quality, full time starters that are all UFA. Still a good change that the Colts can sign one of them.

Poe or Hankins at NT. That is what we are down to if we are going to get help at the position in free agency.

T.J. McDonald, Morris Claiborne, Bradley McDougald, Nickell Robey-Coleman, Jarius Byrd or Darius Butler from that list for secondary help. I would love for us to see Butler back along with, perhaps, T.J. McDonald. I think top end CB help is going to have to come from the top of our draft with rookie growing pains.

Cheers,

[FatDT]

I think there's a solid chance Poe signs here still. How could Miami afford to pay him what he wants when they already have almost $44 million tied up in their defensive line this year?

[Wyatt]

@AllbrightNFL 14h14 hours ago
I'm told Dontari Poe is "very excited" about his impending visit w/ the #Dolphins. They were always near the top of his list. Now about $

[sherck]

I think there's a solid chance Poe signs here still. How could Miami afford to pay him what he wants when they already have almost $44 million tied up in their defensive line this year?

They have about $16m left in this year's cap to sign new free agents. They have not signed anyone yet for big money; safety Nate Allen got $3.4m on his 1 year deal.

They play the Cheats twice a year. They want to bury them like HOU did in the first half of their playoff game. To do that, they need to dominate at the LoS. Poe will help them do that.

Cheers,

[natagu23]

Other than John Simon, its been a pretty pathetic free agency.

Ballard better nail the draft.

[natagu23]

I think there's a solid chance Poe signs here still. How could Miami afford to pay him what he wants when they already have almost $44 million tied up in their defensive line this year?

Doubt it.

New contract plus Falls/Winters in Florida are pretty hard to beat whether its Jax or Miami.

[njcoltfan]

@ProFootballTalk 5m5 minutes ago
Dontari Poe takes his free agent tour to Miami

Could the Colts be done dabbling in FA ??

[rcubed]

Why haven't the top ILBs signed anywhere?

[smitty46953]

Doubt it.

New contract plus Falls/Winters in Florida are pretty hard to beat whether its Jax or Miami.

Not to mention no State of Florida Income Tax ... Do you really think these guys sign with Jacksonville, Tampa and Miami to chase a ring? It's strictly financial ... "Show me Da'Money" :cool:

[sherck]

Why haven't the top ILBs signed anywhere?

That is what I keep asking. It is like they all said "let's hold for a while to drive up the frenzy......"

Don't know if that is the reason but it curious to me that of the top 4/5/6 ILBs on the market, the only one to have signed a contract is Ray-Ray Armstrong who is a marginal starter at best.

Cheers,

[bertjones]

Not to mention no State of Florida Income Tax ... Do you really think these guys sign with Jacksonville, Tampa and Miami to chase a ring? It's strictly financial ... "Show me Da'Money" :cool:

Very true. Although I can't help thinking that maybe Poe heard Chuck's
"chopping wood" spiel and decided to get the hell out of Dodge.

[natagu23]

Not to mention no State of Florida Income Tax ... Do you really think these guys sign with Jacksonville, Tampa and Miami to chase a ring? It's strictly financial ... "Show me Da'Money" :cool:

Its solely about the money.

I understand the low shelf life of the average NFL player and trying to maximize profit, but going to a non-contender for a few extra million is something that I just dont understand.

4 year/56 million with Bortles

Or

4 year/50 million with Luck. Id go with Luck.

Maybe its the lifestyle i guess.

You give a lot hard working people out there 50 million dollars, most of them will have more money than started off with in 5 years.

I know i would.

[VeveJones007]

Why haven't the top ILBs signed anywhere?

Waiting for Hightower to set the market. Why settle for $7MM/year now if Hightower ends up getting $12MM/year? You may be able to negotiate for more once Hightower's deal is done.

[natagu23]

Waiting for Hightower to set the market. Why settle for $7MM/year now if Hightower ends up getting $12MM/year? You may be able to negotiate for more once Hightower's deal is done.

Good point

[GoBigBlue88]

I don't agree w/ Big Joe a ton, but one thing he pointed out that I did like: whereas Grigson would never let a guy leave Indy, because he'd pay him whatever, Ballard has proven that he sticks to a number and lets guys take it or leave.

I like a GM that sticks to his research on value. This bodes well for the draft, IMO.

[Wyatt]

@RapSheet
The #Raiders are getting a visit from #Bills FA LB Zach Brown, source said. Would be an upgrade over what they had last year.

[Wyatt]

@SiriusXMNFL
#Colts RB Robert Turbin: I've been texting with Dontari Poe trying to get him to sign with us and add to this defense

[Puck]

Hightower re signs with the Pats

[rcubed]

Its solely about the money.

I understand the low shelf life of the average NFL player and trying to maximize profit, but going to a non-contender for a few extra million is something that I just dont understand.

4 year/56 million with Bortles

Or

4 year/50 million with Luck. Id go with Luck.

Maybe its the lifestyle i guess.

You give a lot hard working people out there 50 million dollars, most of them will have more money than started off with in 5 years.

I know i would.
extra 6M with no state taxes
florida vs. indiana (especially in the winter)

these guys want to get paid, and as you stated they have a short window to do it, and I dont blame them. doesnt surprise me at all. fans want them to sacrifice money for the chance to win, not the players in general

we are not considered the contenders we once were, even with luck. if you make that argument with an aging vet who really wants to win one and goes to NE or maybe a team like dallas, then sure. but in general, they go where the money is best.

you mentioned giving hard working people 50M. 70% of lottery winners go broke. 78% of nfl players go broke within a couple years of retirement. people are largely dumb and irresponsible.

[Wyatt]

Hightower re signs with the Pats

@AdamSchefter 8s8 seconds ago
Patriots are giving LB Dont'a Hightower a 4-year, $43.5M deal that includes $19M guaranteed, per @_sportstrust.

[natagu23]

@AdamSchefter 8s8 seconds ago
Patriots are giving LB Dont'a Hightower a 4-year, $43.5M deal that includes $19M guaranteed, per @_sportstrust.

Not bad

[Brylok]

@AdamSchefter 8s8 seconds ago
Patriots are giving LB Dont'a Hightower a 4-year, $43.5M deal that includes $19M guaranteed, per @_sportstrust.
Well, shit. Of course they are.

[natagu23]

Well, shit. Of course they are.

You dont SBs in March, but with Tom Brady, you can punch your ticket.

[Wyatt]

yet they still feel the need to cheat any opportunity they can....

[Dam8610]

Well, shit. Of course they are.

That sets the market, so hopefully we'll see one of Brown, Minter, or Hodges sign here soon. Any updates on Poe?

[natagu23]

That sets the market, so hopefully we'll see one of Brown, Minter, or Hodges sign here soon. Any updates on Poe?

F**k Poe

[rcubed]

Well, shit. Of course they are.
they are really going for it with only a few years of brady left

[Wyatt]

That sets the market, so hopefully we'll see one of Brown, Minter, or Hodges sign here soon. Any updates on Poe?

He's being wined and dined in Miami last I knew

[Brylok]

You dont SBs in March, but with Tom Brady, you can punch your ticket.
Yeah, nobody in the AFC is going to stop them. I doubt that DA is going to complain about his role anymore. He moved on up.

[natagu23]

they are really going for it with only a few years of brady left

He'll probably win 1 more when its all said and done.

[sherck]

@AdamSchefter 8s8 seconds ago
Patriots are giving LB Dont'a Hightower a 4-year, $43.5M deal that includes $19M guaranteed, per @_sportstrust.
$11m a year. There is the standard.

Watch the rest of the ILBs start inking deals over the next 24 hours.

===============

On another note, I was talking to my friend who is a Cheats fan (yeah, I have one of those) and he used the term "going all in" to describe what he feels like Bellicheat is doing this year.

Bellicheat is famous for stockpiling draft picks for future years and to keep developing low priced talent. You either take the NE contract discount or you walk.

However, this season, he has:

A. Traded away many of his early round draft picks. His top pick currently is 3rd round #72 overall with only three picks in the top four rounds total.

B. Signed "big ticket" contracts for folks other than Brady.

Gilmore at $13.000m a year average
Hightower at $10.875m a year average
Solder at $10.016m a year average
Allen at $7.350m a year average (trade but....)

That is 4 of their top 8 contract averages (not Brady, McCourty, Gronkowski, Cannon) signed in 2017.

And that is with Brady, McCourty and Cannon all signing their contracts in 2016. Gronk signed his current contract in 2014.



If the cheats win the SB for 2017, then they will be tied with the Pittsburgh Steelers in SB franchise wins (6) and HC SB wins (6 with Chuck Noll).



If the cheats win the SB for the 2018 season, they will set the new franchise SB win record with 7, HC SB win record with 7 and be the first team in NFL history to "3-peat" SB victories.



Brady has already won the "QB with most SB victories" record with 5 wins.



We could be looking at the end of the Bellicheat/Tommy Cheater era in the next year or two if they are pushing for short-term gain and long-term ruin.

Cheers,

[natagu23]

$11m a year. There is the standard.

Watch the rest of the ILBs start inking deals over the next 24 hours.

===============

On another note, I was talking to my friend who is a Cheats fan (yeah, I have one of those) and he used the term "going all in" to describe what he feels like Bellicheat is doing this year.

Bellicheat is famous for stockpiling draft picks for future years and to keep developing low priced talent. You either take the NE contract discount or you walk.

However, this season, he has:

A. Traded away many of his early round draft picks. His top pick currently is 3rd round #72 overall with only three picks in the top four rounds total.

B. Signed "big ticket" contracts for folks other than Brady.

Gilmore at $13.000m a year average
Hightower at $10.875m a year average
Solder at $10.016m a year average
Allen at $7.350m a year average (trade but....)

That is 4 of their top 8 contract averages (not Brady, McCourty, Gronkowski, Cannon) signed in 2017.

And that is with Brady, McCourty and Cannon all signing their contracts in 2016. Gronk signed his current contract in 2014.



If the cheats win the SB for 2017, then they will be tied with the Pittsburgh Steelers in SB franchise wins (6) and HC SB wins (6 with Chuck Noll).



If the cheats win the SB for the 2018 season, they will set the new franchise SB win record with 7, HC SB win record with 7 and be the first team in NFL history to "3-peat" SB victories.



Brady has already won the "QB with most SB victories" record with 5 wins.



We could be looking at the end of the Bellicheat/Tommy Cheater era in the next year or two if they are pushing for short-term gain and long-term ruin.

Cheers,

Its like the Jordan effect. You're not winning a championship until the guy retires.

The only team in the AFC that poses a threat to Patsies are the Raiders imo, but they have to really sure up that run defense if they have a legit shot.

[YDFL Commish]

If the cheats win the SB for 2017, then they will be tied with the Pittsburgh Steelers in SB franchise wins (6) and HC SB wins (6 with Chuck Noll).
Cheers,

Noll has only 4 HC SB wins.

[VeveJones007]

$11m a year. There is the standard.

Watch the rest of the ILBs start inking deals over the next 24 hours.

===============

On another note, I was talking to my friend who is a Cheats fan (yeah, I have one of those) and he used the term "going all in" to describe what he feels like Bellicheat is doing this year.

Bellicheat is famous for stockpiling draft picks for future years and to keep developing low priced talent. You either take the NE contract discount or you walk.

However, this season, he has:

A. Traded away many of his early round draft picks. His top pick currently is 3rd round #72 overall with only three picks in the top four rounds total.

B. Signed "big ticket" contracts for folks other than Brady.

Gilmore at $13.000m a year average
Hightower at $10.875m a year average
Solder at $10.016m a year average
Allen at $7.350m a year average (trade but....)

That is 4 of their top 8 contract averages (not Brady, McCourty, Gronkowski, Cannon) signed in 2017.

And that is with Brady, McCourty and Cannon all signing their contracts in 2016. Gronk signed his current contract in 2014.



If the cheats win the SB for 2017, then they will be tied with the Pittsburgh Steelers in SB franchise wins (6) and HC SB wins (6 with Chuck Noll).



If the cheats win the SB for the 2018 season, they will set the new franchise SB win record with 7, HC SB win record with 7 and be the first team in NFL history to "3-peat" SB victories.



Brady has already won the "QB with most SB victories" record with 5 wins.



We could be looking at the end of the Bellicheat/Tommy Cheater era in the next year or two if they are pushing for short-term gain and long-term ruin.

Cheers,

Always remember that a 40 year old All Pro QB is just one hit away from being a below average QB.

[rcubed]

hey ballard, go sign zach brown already

[rcubed]

Its solely about the money.

I understand the low shelf life of the average NFL player and trying to maximize profit, but going to a non-contender for a few extra million is something that I just dont understand.

4 year/56 million with Bortles

Or

4 year/50 million with Luck. Id go with Luck.

Maybe its the lifestyle i guess.

You give a lot hard working people out there 50 million dollars, most of them will have more money than started off with in 5 years.

I know i would.
prime example:

calais campbell grew up in the denver area and was offered a contract by the broncos. here is a quote from him in regards to playing with a top D player on a team that has been in the thick of things the past few years

Campbell had a pretty high-profile choice to make between the Jaguars and the Broncos. Jacksonville offered the most money, but Denver had the track record and one of the best defensive players in football in Von Miller. Without some of those players in place, could we have seen Campbell change his mind?

"Playing with Von Miller was a big temptation," he said. "He's going to be a first-ballot Hall of Famer. Playing next to a guy like that is a positive, because you feed off a guy like that. That would have been cool. Also, being home would have been a good situation.

He chose to go to JAX. Furthermore, the article states he signed with them without even talking to head coach Doug Marrone or executive vice president Tom Coughlin.

JAX offered more money.

To be fair he spouts some stuff about leaving his mark on a young team, blah blah blah.

Did I mention JAX offered more money?

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000793199/article/campbell-didnt-talk-to-marrone-before-jags-signing

[Racehorse]

Any updates on Poe?Sounds like a good fit for the Ravens to me.

[smitty46953]

Rather have Johnathan Hankins DT than Poe along with Zack Brown LB, Kevin Minter LB, & Darius Butler S/CB back ... Do something Grigs (Anyone remember that line?) ... :cool:

[omahacolt]

Sounds like a good fit for the Ravens to me.

Sounds like a bad joke to me

[VeveJones007]

Poe done meeting with Dolphins. No deal yet.

Have to think the Colts are still in the running.

[Coltsalr]

@FieldYates
Colts have been actively monitoring the ILB market. Sean Spence, Kevin Minter & Jon Bostic have all been in for recent visits, per source.

[Racehorse]

Sounds like a bad joke to me

Seriously? Nevermore!

[natagu23]

@FieldYates
Colts have been actively monitoring the ILB market. Sean Spence, Kevin Minter & Jon Bostic have all been in for recent visits, per source.

No to all those guys.

[Luck4Reich]

F**k Poe

You sure can if you enjoy big black fatties.

[sherck]

No to all those guys.
I like Minter.

The others? No to them.

Cheers,

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[Puck]

Ian Rapoport‏ @RapSheet

He's in Oakland now. Brown has also had talks with the #Colts about a potential deal.

[GoBigBlue88]

It sounds like this Raekwon McMillan kid from OSU could be a legit ILB in this year's draft. Any Buckeyes fans here want to speak to that and/or his fit in a Ravens-style defense? May somewhat limit what Ballard would want to pay for FA ILB.

[VeveJones007]

It sounds like this Raekwon McMillan kid from OSU could be a legit ILB in this year's draft. Any Buckeyes fans here want to speak to that and/or his fit in a Ravens-style defense? May somewhat limit what Ballard would want to pay for FA ILB.

Would be a great get at 2.14 based on the scouting reports I've read and the few videos I've seen. EDGE at 1.15 and McMillan at 2.14 would be a special haul. If Ballard can find some corners in rounds 3-4, the defense will have its foundation that it has lacked since Freeney and Mathis were in their prime.

[sherck]

From an NFL.com article titled "Best team fit for notable remaining free agents."


Johnathan Hankins, defensive tackle

NFL fans don't know Hankins well after his first four years in the league, but it's surprising to see NFL teams share the apathy. The defensive tackle market has been slow to develop throughout free agency, with Dontari Poe also still available and Bennie Logan not signing a contract until Monday. Turning 25 years old at the end of the month, Hankins boasts impressive upside and experience as a three-year starter for the Giants. How many 320-pound run stuffers have a seven-sack season on their résumé?

Our No. 3 free agent still available, Hankins has generated suboptimal buzz. He looks destined to wind up on a short-term deal with a team looking for value. The Falcons, Colts, Dolphins and Packers should be in the market for a defensive tackle like Hankins, with the first three teams meeting with Poe. The Colts already have shown an eye for value early in free agency. Getting Hankins at a discount rate would make a lot of sense.

BEST FIT: Indianapolis Colts



While I don't think that he is a true 3-4 NT, he is available, probably cheaper than Poe and would help stabilize the position for a year or two along with perhaps a rookie draft pick and/or Parry if he is retained.

We need someone with beef manning the middle and while Hankins is not ideal, he is a 3-year NFL starter with talent who would be a plus for our defense.

I don't know why this deal and a deal for an ILB is not getting done TODAY.

Cheers,

[smitty46953]

My Wish List from remaining Free Agents ... :cool:

Johnathan Hankins DT
Zack Brown LB
Kevin Minter LB
Darius Butler S/CB
Morris Claiborne CB

Still available ... :cool:

[smitty46953]

From an NFL.com article titled "Best team fit for notable remaining free agents."


Johnathan Hankins, defensive tackle

NFL fans don't know Hankins well after his first four years in the league, but it's surprising to see NFL teams share the apathy. The defensive tackle market has been slow to develop throughout free agency, with Dontari Poe also still available and Bennie Logan not signing a contract until Monday. Turning 25 years old at the end of the month, Hankins boasts impressive upside and experience as a three-year starter for the Giants. How many 320-pound run stuffers have a seven-sack season on their résumé?

Our No. 3 free agent still available, Hankins has generated suboptimal buzz. He looks destined to wind up on a short-term deal with a team looking for value. The Falcons, Colts, Dolphins and Packers should be in the market for a defensive tackle like Hankins, with the first three teams meeting with Poe. The Colts already have shown an eye for value early in free agency. Getting Hankins at a discount rate would make a lot of sense.

BEST FIT: Indianapolis Colts



While I don't think that he is a true 3-4 NT, he is available, probably cheaper than Poe and would help stabilize the position for a year or two along with perhaps a rookie draft pick and/or Parry if he is retained.

We need someone with beef manning the middle and while Hankins is not ideal, he is a 3-year NFL starter with talent who would be a plus for our defense.

I don't know why this deal and a deal for an ILB is not getting done TODAY.

Cheers,

Been my choice all along ... Won't complain with Poe but think overall Hankins should be here ... :cool:

[Maniac]

From the miami herald via rotoworld:



Free agent DT Johnathan Hankins has been holding firm that he wants a multi-year contract.
Hankins, 25 later this month, has surprisingly drawn zero interest in the 7-10 days free agency has been open. Easily one of the best players left on the market, Hankins wants to be a starter and seeks $8 million-plus per year. According to Dolphins ace beat writer Armando Salguero, Miami checked in on Hankins, but he isn't willing to accept a one-year offer. Hankins went into this reportedly wanting a five-year deal at $45 million or more. That's highly unlikely to happen at this stage of free agency. Whoever eventually lands Hankins could be getting a bargain.

[sherck]

Free agent DT Johnathan Hankins has been holding firm that he wants a multi-year contract.
Hankins, 25 later this month, has surprisingly drawn zero interest in the 7-10 days free agency has been open. Easily one of the best players left on the market, Hankins wants to be a starter and seeks $8 million-plus per year. According to Dolphins ace beat writer Armando Salguero, Miami checked in on Hankins, but he isn't willing to accept a one-year offer. Hankins went into this reportedly wanting a five-year deal at $45 million or more. That's highly unlikely to happen at this stage of free agency. Whoever eventually lands Hankins could be getting a bargain.
I would give him a multi-year deal....say 3-year, $15 - 18m to come play NT for us.

That would give Hankins the opportunity to develop into a stud NT for us and then get paid his next contract at 28 years old in the Brandon Williams range

-- OR --

Gives us up to 2 years to find his replacement through the draft and groom him to take over once Hankins walks at the end of the contract.

I don't think Hankins will be world class as a 3-4 NT unless he develops more than he has so far in his career.

But, he would be solid/good/NFL average which is what we need right now as we find, hopefully, draftee studs over the next 2 - 3 years to fill in at the top of our defensive depth chart.

You have to have everyone be NFL average for the impact players to then be able to do their job well. We need NFL average everywhere before anyone stud we draft will shine.

Hankins will probably be NFL average at a spot that I don't think the draft will provide for. We might get a low round NT backup in the draft but not a day one starter.

Cheers,

[sherck]

Interesting quote about our new interior O-lineman, Brian Schwenke.

Earlier today, new Colts offensive lineman Brian Schwenke had a chance to speak with the media, and he explained the reason he signed with the Colts: he said they offered him an “opportunity to compete” for a starting spot, according to the Anderson Herald Bulletin’s George Bremer.

Additionally, FOX59’s Mike Chappell noted that Schwenke said he knows it will be at right guard instead of center because Ryan Kelly is already entrenched as the starting center.

A question many have been asking since the Colts signed Schwenke a few days ago has been what the lineman’s role will be, with most assuming that it will probably be as a depth guard/center, in a very similar role to the one that Jonotthan Harrison occupied last year. But Schwenke seemed to make it clear that he’ll have an opportunity to compete for the starting right guard spot.

That statement shouldn’t come as any surprise, however, especially if you’ve been paying attention to Chris Ballard’s emphasis on competition. The new Colts GM is looking to increase the competition level all over Indy’s roster so that guys have to fight for starting spots, and it’s likely that all of his free agency moves will be driven at least somewhat by that desire to improve competition. So with Brian Schwenke, the Colts add a guy who has played in 41 games and started 28 of them during his time with the Titans to push Joe Haeg, Le’Raven Clark, and Denzelle Good on the right side of the line. That’s a good thing.

None of that means that Schwenke will wind up as the starting right guard, however, as it’s probably best to think of Joe Haeg as still being the frontrunner to start at that spot. But the Colts don’t want to just hand those spots that are up for grabs out automatically, so they’re adding guys like Brian Schwenke to compete. He choose the Colts because of that, and it’s been a major emphasis by Chris Ballard already during his short time in Indianapolis. That emphasis will surely continue, too - and it means we’ll have a competition to monitor on the right side of the Colts’ line this offseason and into training camp.

I like it. Schwenke is not all-pro but he is solid enough to be a 28 game starter. He will push Haeg, Clark and Good to be better and that will make our entire O-Line better.

Depending on the contract size, this was a great move. I cannot imagine that the contract will be huge considering he was not signed as the "starter" from the bat and I am predicting about $2.5m a year average for him.

Cheers,

[Maniac]

I would give him a multi-year deal....say 3-year, $15 - 18m to come play NT for us.

That would give Hankins the opportunity to develop into a stud NT for us and then get paid his next contract at 28 years old in the Brandon Williams range

-- OR --

Gives us up to 2 years to find his replacement through the draft and groom him to take over once Hankins walks at the end of the contract.

I don't think Hankins will be world class as a 3-4 NT unless he develops more than he has so far in his career.

But, he would be solid/good/NFL average which is what we need right now as we find, hopefully, draftee studs over the next 2 - 3 years to fill in at the top of our defensive depth chart.

You have to have everyone be NFL average for the impact players to then be able to do their job well. We need NFL average everywhere before anyone stud we draft will shine.

Hankins will probably be NFL average at a spot that I don't think the draft will provide for. We might get a low round NT backup in the draft but not a day one starter.

Cheers,

$5m-$6m would be worth signing him. If he's insisting on $8m+, then that's too much IMO

[natagu23]

I would give him a multi-year deal....say 3-year, $15 - 18m to come play NT for us.

That would give Hankins the opportunity to develop into a stud NT for us and then get paid his next contract at 28 years old in the Brandon Williams range

-- OR --

Gives us up to 2 years to find his replacement through the draft and groom him to take over once Hankins walks at the end of the contract.

I don't think Hankins will be world class as a 3-4 NT unless he develops more than he has so far in his career.

But, he would be solid/good/NFL average which is what we need right now as we find, hopefully, draftee studs over the next 2 - 3 years to fill in at the top of our defensive depth chart.

You have to have everyone be NFL average for the impact players to then be able to do their job well. We need NFL average everywhere before anyone stud we draft will shine.

Hankins will probably be NFL average at a spot that I don't think the draft will provide for. We might get a low round NT backup in the draft but not a day one starter.

Cheers,

Hankins has the potential to be a good NT.

He and "Snacks" were pretty disruptive and were a force against the run.

The thing I like about him is his ability to get pressure on the QB.

[HoosierinFL]

$5m-$6m would be worth signing him. If he's insisting on $8m+, then that's too much IMO

I'd give him $8m/yr on a 2 year deal. If he wants a longer deal it has to be for less.

[FatDT]

I don't want Hankins. He's gotten fat since college and I don't think that would get any better with a big FA contract.

[Wyatt]

@pfrumors 3m3 minutes ago
The #Dolphins have inquired on #Giants free agent DT Johnathan Hankins. Story here:

[Wyatt]

@_SportsTrust
Al Woods has agreed to terms with the @Colts. #Colts #LegendsLiveHere

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C7DERqgWgAAKdZN.jpg

[natagu23]

I dont get it.

I honestly dont.

[Wyatt]

@HolderStephen 26s27 seconds ago
Al Woods, for the record, is a good competition signing. He's relatively athletic for his size (6-4, 307) from what I recall of him.

@HolderStephen 53s54 seconds ago
He turns 30 in a couple weeks but has been pretty healthy in recent years.

does this mean we're done searching for a NT now?

[natagu23]

I don't want Hankins. He's gotten fat since college and I don't think that would get any better with a big FA contract.

You're the first person that im aware of who has pointed out Hankins has gotten fat.

[smitty46953]

Ian Rapoport‏Verified account @RapSheet · 2m2 minutes ago

Former #Seahawks and #Saints DL John Jenkins is visiting the #Bears today, source said, and he’s at the #Colts tomorrow. A rare true NT

:cool:

[smitty46953]

Ian Rapoport‏Verified account @RapSheet · 2m2 minutes ago
The #Colts signed DL Al Woods, formerly of the #Titans, per @_SportsTrust. More depth & competition in Indy. 2-year contract worth $5M total
:cool:

[smitty46953]

Jacksonville Jaguars‏Verified account
@Jaguars

The #Jaguars have signed LB Josh McNary.

:cool:

[Wyatt]

@Jaguars
The #Jaguars have signed LB Josh McNary.

[FatDT]

Woods is 29 but already has 8 years in the NFL. Probably just a depth signing.

[smitty46953]

Jason La Canfora‏Verified account @JasonLaCanfora · 27s28 seconds ago
Veteran DB Darius Butler has another round of visits scheduled, starting with Washington today. Colts want him back. Visited CHI already

:cool:

[Thorgrim]

Sign him damnit.

[GoBigBlue88]

Just going to pretend Al Woods is Al Haynesworth.

[Butter]

Just going to pretend Al Woods is Al Haynesworth.

We shall henceforth call him Woodsworth.

[Wyatt]

Gotta have wood to chop more wood

[rcubed]

I want to hear less "bringing in for competition"

and more "he is a stud and will start immediately for us"

[smitty46953]

I want to hear less "bringing in for competition"

and more "he is a stud and will start immediately for us"

I don't mind the competition, but you are right a couple nice starters would be nice ... :cool:

[Colt Classic]

I want to hear less "bringing in for competition"

and more "he is a stud and will start immediately for us"

Culture-changing signings?

[smitty46953]

#Falcons are signing former #Chiefs first round pick DT Dontari Poe, per @ProFootballTalk

:cool:

[sherck]

At this point, they are bringing in guys who "might" be okay on the D-Line and throwing them at the wall hoping a couple of them stick. It is obvious that they don't want to pay much for their bodies at this point.

D-Line really cannot be a focus of this draft. LB and Secondary are in much worst shape than the D-Line.

I am not saying that our D-Line is good but they at least have the bodies that MIGHT make it a good D-Line. Guys like Anderson, Langford and Jones should be good but due to injuries, none of them are dominate.

We have two younger guys who have shown flashes (Ridgeway, Parry) but one of them might be in the big house starting this upcoming season.

Bringing guys in like Woods and Hunt (and perhaps Jenkins) is a way to make sure that whoever rises to the top will at least be NFL average (hopefully) of the mass of bodies that we might have there.

Low risk, medium reward seems to be the theme of much of the Colts free agency focus this off-season. Schwenke, Mingo, Hunt and Woods are all in that category. At least they are all O-Line or Defensive Front 7. Build up the trenches.

Sheard, Simon and Locke are the only guys we have signed as "starters" so far.

Cheers,

[Wyatt]

@ProFootballTalk
Per source, Dontari Poe agrees to terms with Falcons.

WELL FUCK

[smitty46953]

Adam Schefter‏Verified account
@AdamSchefter

Falcons have agreed to terms with Dontari Poe, per source.


:cool:

[smitty46953]

Now go get Hankins !!! :cool:

[sherck]

#Falcons are signing former #Chiefs first round pick DT Dontari Poe, per @ProFootballTalk

:cool:
They were dumb play calling away from winning the SB in Jan (run the ball 3 fricking times and then kick the FG to go up by two scores, dummies). Why not sign with a team that has SB aspirations again this year?

Cheers,

[Wyatt]

@AdamSchefter 21s21 seconds ago
Falcons gave former Chiefs' DT Dontari Poe a one-year, $8 million deal that could increase to $10M with incentives, per source.

[Luck4Reich]

They were dumb play calling away from winning the SB in Jan (run the ball 3 fricking times and then kick the FG to go up by two scores, dummies). Why not sign with a team that has SB aspirations again this year?

Cheers,

Only 14% on Suberbowl losers made it back the next year and that percentage was helped by the Buffalo Bills.

[Coltsalr]

$8M for one year was too rich for our blood? The fuck, Ballard?

[sherck]

@AdamSchefter 21s21 seconds ago
Falcons gave former Chiefs' DT Dontari Poe a one-year, $8 million deal that could increase to $10M with incentives, per source.

I am honestly glad that we did not sign him to terms like that.

We are not one year away from being competitive. We are more like 2 or 3 years away from having a good defense.

I would rather sign "NFL average" guys now like Woods, Hunt and Mingo for modest contracts while biding my time to nab good players (Sheard, Simon) and difference makers (1-15 pass rusher?) in the draft and free agency.

In 2 or 3 years when we are ready to compete? Yeah, that is the time to splurge on big contracts.

But now? Keep filling the roster with "competition" so that we can at least get to the middle of the pack defense.

Chees,

[Wyatt]

I hear Tom Crean is a free agent now, maybe we could plug him in at NT, or better yet, HC

[FatDT]

I kinda wanted Poe. I think our defense is going to suck again. But I don't have high hopes for this season anyway. So outside of not getting Zeitler or Warford I don't care that much that we didn't sign any "big" names. I use that term loosely because FA was kind of garbage this year. Hopefully we have a good draft and bring in a few actual playmakers/future playmakers.

[smitty46953]

I hear Tom Crean is a free agent now, maybe we could plug him in at NT, or better yet, HC

You have lost your mind ... two clappers on the sidelines ??? :cool:

[Racehorse]

You're the first person that im aware of who has pointed out Hankins has gotten fat.
Takes one to know one situation?

[rcubed]

I am honestly glad that we did not sign him to terms like that.

We are not one year away from being competitive. We are more like 2 or 3 years away from having a good defense.

I would rather sign "NFL average" guys now like Woods, Hunt and Mingo for modest contracts while biding my time to nab good players (Sheard, Simon) and difference makers (1-15 pass rusher?) in the draft and free agency.

In 2 or 3 years when we are ready to compete? Yeah, that is the time to splurge on big contracts.

But now? Keep filling the roster with "competition" so that we can at least get to the middle of the pack defense.

Chees,
I agree in general. One year contracts are not where we are at. That's for a last push to get over the hump. Signing the average guys to build a foundation is a good start, but it would have been nice to land a bouye or hightower in FA. Hopefully we draft well given how deep this year is supposed to be.

[sherck]

I agree in general. One year contracts are not where we are at. That's for a last push to get over the hump. Signing the average guys to build a foundation is a good start, but it would have been nice to land a bouye or hightower in FA. Hopefully we draft well given how deep this year is supposed to be.
That is what I am hoping for.

I hope that the defensive talent it deep enough that we can, with our six picks in the first four rounds, get 4 or 5 guys that become starters or quality depth guys in the next 2-3 years.

Sort of like we drafted 3 offensive linemen in 2016 that might end up being starts in 2017.

2 drafts like that in 2017 and 2018 along with solid free agent signings will get our defense into the top half of the league.

And with our offense, that is really all we need in the short term.

Cheers,

[Dam8610]

I agree in general. One year contracts are not where we are at. That's for a last push to get over the hump. Signing the average guys to build a foundation is a good start, but it would have been nice to land a bouye or hightower in FA. Hopefully we draft well given how deep this year is supposed to be.

I think getting Zach Brown or Gerald Hodges would elevate the overall talent level of the ILB position and the LB corps in general.

[sherck]

I think getting Zach Brown or Gerald Hodges would elevate the overall talent level of the ILB position and the LB corps in general.
That is the signing that I am waiting on.

Brown, Hodges or Minter (along with bringing Butler back) would round out what I think we will be doing in free agency prior to the draft.

Not that I think we signed world-beaters at any position but:

NT Addressed = Woods upgrading Kerr in the NT rotation
DE Addressed = Hunt adding to the mix of Anderson, Langford, Jones, Ridgeway and McGill
OLB[EDGE] Addressed = Simon upgrading on Walden
OLB[RUSH] Addressed = Sheard, Mingo upgrading on Mathis, Cole
ILB Addressed = No
CB Addressed = Not really but re-signing Butler will help
Safety Addressed = Again, no but re-signing Butler will help
O-Line addressed = Schwenke replacing Harrison as primary depth pushing for starting at RG
Punter addressed = Locke

Of our needs, ILB and CB are wide, gaping holes that need veteran talent thrown at it to stabilize them.

Brown / Hodges / Minter do that at ILB

Butler does that at CB (and Safety)

Get it done, Ballard!

Cheers,

[njcoltfan]

That is the signing that I am waiting on.

Brown, Hodges or Minter (along with bringing Butler back) would round out what I think we will be doing in free agency prior to the draft.

Not that I think we signed world-beaters at any position but:

NT Addressed = Woods upgrading Kerr in the NT rotation
DE Addressed = Hunt adding to the mix of Anderson, Langford, Jones, Ridgeway and McGill
OLB[EDGE] Addressed = Simon upgrading on Walden
OLB[RUSH] Addressed = Sheard, Mingo upgrading on Mathis, Cole
ILB Addressed = No
CB Addressed = Not really but re-signing Butler will help
Safety Addressed = Again, no but re-signing Butler will help
O-Line addressed = Schwenke replacing Harrison as primary depth pushing for starting at RG
Punter addressed = Locke

Of our needs, ILB and CB are wide, gaping holes that need veteran talent thrown at it to stabilize them.

Brown / Hodges / Minter do that at ILB

Butler does that at CB (and Safety)

Get it done, Ballard!

Cheers,

You keep asking Ballard to " get it done ", I don't think he's listening. I want him to get Hankins signed, again he's not listening.

[Wyatt]

@JordanRaanan
Reached out to sources around league and found that DT Johnathan Hankins is asking for A LOT of money. A lot as in more than $10M per year.

[smitty46953]

@JordanRaanan
Reached out to sources around league and found that DT Johnathan Hankins is asking for A LOT of money. A lot as in more than $10M per year.

Ouch !!! :cool:

[njcoltfan]

@JordanRaanan
Reached out to sources around league and found that DT Johnathan Hankins is asking for A LOT of money. A lot as in more than $10M per year.

So, he's only 24 and, if I'm not mistaken, had 8 sacks last year, and he's healthy. It's not like the Colts don't have the money.

[FatDT]

So, he's only 24 and, if I'm not mistaken, had 8 sacks last year, and he's healthy. It's not like the Colts don't have the money.

On the contrary, he had 3 sacks and missed 7 games in 2015 with a torn pectoral. He did play all of 2016.

I dunno. I wouldn't pay him $10+ million. Brandon Williams was the best FA NT available and didn't get $10 mil/year.

[Brylok]

Only 14% on Suberbowl losers made it back the next year and that percentage was helped by the Buffalo Bills.
And the Falcons lost in perhaps the biggest choke-job of all time. Historic losers. They won't sniff a Super Bowl this year.

[natagu23]

Watch a little bit of the guy's tape. NTs who can stack and shed and make a tackle are hard to come by. Ask Grigson.

There is no f**king chess being played here when you're leaving key positions unfilled. Sign the guy and move on down the checklist.

F**k.

[Brylok]

Jason La Canfora‏Verified account @JasonLaCanfora · 27s28 seconds ago
Veteran DB Darius Butler has another round of visits scheduled, starting with Washington today. Colts want him back. Visited CHI already

:cool:
Butler must be trying to force the Colts to pay up. Why would anyone go to Washington? Their culture is the worst in the NFL. Complete grease fire. Worse than the Browns.

[smitty46953]

Butler must be trying to force the Colts to pay up. Why would anyone go to Washington? Their culture is the worst in the NFL. Complete grease fire. Worse than the Browns.

Can't blame him, we left him hanging. We should have re-signed him before the free agency period started... :cool:

[omahacolt]

Butler must be trying to force the Colts to pay up. Why would anyone go to Washington? Their culture is the worst in the NFL. Complete grease fire. Worse than the Browns.

manusky is the dc there isn't he?

[Brylok]

He is. Apparently he got promoted in January. I was mainly referring to the owner and front office. Absolutely toxic environment from Snyder on down.

[Puck]

manusky is the dc there isn't he?


http://bfy.tw/Ag58

[omahacolt]

He is. Apparently he got promoted in January. I was mainly referring to the owner and front office. Absolutely toxic environment from Snyder on down.

an extra million dollars sure makes that shit not so toxic now doesn't it

[njcoltfan]

On the contrary, he had 3 sacks and missed 7 games in 2015 with a torn pectoral. He did play all of 2016.

I dunno. I wouldn't pay him $10+ million. Brandon Williams was the best FA NT available and didn't get $10 mil/year.

Sorry, my bad, I was looking at his 2014 stats and was even wrong with those as he only had 7 sacks. I still would sign him, he could anchor the defense for years to come.

[YDFL Commish]

Watch a little bit of the guy's tape. NTs who can stack and shed and make a tackle are hard to come by. Ask Grigson.

There is no f**king chess being played here when you're leaving key positions unfilled. Sign the guy and move on down the checklist.

F**k.

You don't pay the guy so much more than the market deems he's worth, you just don't.

When you do, it bites you in the ass and you end up cutting the player in 1-2 yrs.

So why do a short term rental on a 24 yr. old player? Those are the guys, that ideally you want to sign long term.

[natagu23]

You don't pay the guy so much more than the market deems he's worth, you just don't.

When you do, it bites you in the ass and you end up cutting the player in 1-2 yrs.

So why do a short term rental on a 24 yr. old player? Those are the guys, that ideally you want to sign long term.

I get what you're saying but its free-agency.

Every other decent player gets overpaid. We track it every year where an entire position market gets inflated.

My point is, get the player. Yes try the bring the price down, but get the player.

There are no good NTs in the draft.

[natagu23]

Its been how long since we've been trying to get a true NT to make this whole 34 sh*t work?

Yes, its been half a f**king decade.

Im tired of it.

Its either you get the pieces to fit your scheme or change to a different one.

[rcubed]

Its been how long since we've been trying to get a true NT to make this whole 34 sh*t work?

Yes, its been half a f**king decade.

Im tired of it.

Its either you get the pieces to fit your scheme or change to a different one.
clapper dont change schemes

[natagu23]

clapper dont change schemes

How is this guy a HC let alone still coaching this team?

Anyway, Im not a fan of the this 34 hybrid.

It's not as forgiving as the 4-3 when the majority of your defense is mediocre.

[Brylok]

an extra million dollars sure makes that shit not so toxic now doesn't it
Probably depends on specific player's motivations. Their own starting QB wants to escape but will apparently be franchise tagged. Bottom feeders like Cleveland and JAX are just enept/poorly run. The Redskins are a toxic environment.

[VeveJones007]

Its been how long since we've been trying to get a true NT to make this whole 34 sh*t work?

Yes, its been half a f**king decade.

Im tired of it.

Its either you get the pieces to fit your scheme or change to a different one.

Umm...interior DL has been an issue even longer than that. DT/NT for the Colts franchise is like the Browns and QBs.

[rcubed]

How is this guy a HC let alone still coaching this team?

Anyway, Im not a fan of the this 34 hybrid.

It's not as forgiving as the 4-3 when the majority of your defense is mediocre.

How did get past the interview, he can barely speak intelligently.
How did he get an extension?
How did he survive a front office change?

Mysteries we my never solve...

[natagu23]

How did get past the interview, he can barely speak intelligently.
How did he get an extension?
How did he survive a front office change?

Mysteries we my never solve...

Where's Robert Stack when you need him

[VeveJones007]

How did get past the interview, he can barely speak intelligently.
How did he get an extension?
How did he survive a front office change?

Mysteries we my never solve...

Part of me still doesn't get why Irsay canned Grigson so late. The only thing that really makes sense is that Irsay had a deal ready with Peyton, PM wanted a new GM, and it was too late for a HC search and for that HC to assemble a quality staff.

Under that scenario, it would take a few months until PM was formally in the position. Then, he and the GM could evaluate the HC during the 2017 season and lay the groundwork for bringing in a new coach and staff.

That, or Irsay is just irrational...which is Occam's razor here.

[indycolts2]

Anyone else heard this or believe it?

Josina Anderson: Poe had a 5 years 60M offer from the Colts (link: http://dlvr.it/NfD0vp) dlvr.it/NfD0vp #reddit #nfl

No idea who she is but would he really reject that offer if true?

[rcubed]

Part of me still doesn't get why Irsay canned Grigson so late. The only thing that really makes sense is that Irsay had a deal ready with Peyton, PM wanted a new GM, and it was too late for a HC search and for that HC to assemble a quality staff.

Under that scenario, it would take a few months until PM was formally in the position. Then, he and the GM could evaluate the HC during the 2017 season and lay the groundwork for bringing in a new coach and staff.

That, or Irsay is just irrational...which is Occam's razor here.
Sounds plausible

[omahacolt]

Anyone else heard this or believe it?

Josina Anderson: Poe had a 5 years 60M offer from the Colts (link: http://dlvr.it/NfD0vp) dlvr.it/NfD0vp #reddit #nfl

No idea who she is but would he really reject that offer if true?

That is the only place I heard it.

Only way you turn that down is if the guarantees were bad.

[natagu23]

That is the only place I heard it.

Only way you turn that down is if the guarantees were bad.

Or if he wasn't interested in playing here.

[omahacolt]

Or if he wasn't interested in playing here.

True

[DrSpaceman]

One year $8 million for the Falcons.

He was never coming here.

[njcoltfan]

One year $8 million for the Falcons.

He was never coming here.
Why would he ? If we're being honest about the Colt's, they have a roster that's mediocre at best, a head coach that can't get out of his own way and probably is gone at the end of this year, and is years away from contending for a championship. Lets face the reality here, this team as presently constructed, without Luck, is a last place team, but that's JMO.

[smitty46953]

Jason La Canfora‏Verified account @JasonLaCanfora · 29m29 minutes ago

DB Darius Butler plans to re-sign with the Colts on a one-year deal today

:cool:

[smitty46953]

Stephen Holder‏Verified account @HolderStephen · 42s43 seconds ago
This is a 1-year deal for $3 million. Could max out at $4.5 million w incentives, according to NFL source. #Colts

:cool:

[Thorgrim]

Jason La Canfora‏Verified account @JasonLaCanfora · 29m29 minutes ago

DB Darius Butler plans to re-sign with the Colts on a one-year deal today

:cool:

Great news. One year deal makes perfect sense.

[ukcolt]

If the resigning of Butler is true, then that is a good thing in the short term....but doesn't change much in terms of the future and needing to draft some defensive backs.

I have a feeling that the Colts have now decided that they are happy enough with the OLB's.....not sure i agree with that myself, but i do think that in this draft we can try to focus on ILB and corners.

[sherck]

If the resigning of Butler is true, then that is a good thing in the short term....but doesn't change much in terms of the future and needing to draft some defensive backs.

I have a feeling that the Colts have now decided that they are happy enough with the OLB's.....not sure i agree with that myself, but i do think that in this draft we can try to focus on ILB and corners.
I have zero idea what Ballard's mindset is on any of our position depth charts are other than we don't have many playmakers on that side of the ball.

However, what it appears to me that he has done is add bodies to bring as many position groups up to "stabilized" as possible. NT, DE, OLB, S have all had bodies added that should allow them to function at stable or average if not good or great.

CB and ILB are the gaping holes in the depth charts so I agree that those spots will still receive attention.

I am not convinced that we will still not be signing a veteran ILB to the roster. I think teams now are just waiting for another one to be signed before jumping on the rest because they think that every day longer drops the price just a little more.

If we can sign a veteran ILB, then we are pretty much set to pick defensive BPA with our top four picks as long as one of the top three ends up being CB.

Add some combo of defense, TE, RB or O-Linemen with our other 2 picks in the 4th round and use our 5th round pick for one of the lower round NTs to backup Woods/Parry at that spot and it will have been a good offseason.

Cheers,

[Racehorse]

Am I the only one on here who reads what we are doing right now and thinking all of the posts sound just like they did when we got rid of Polian? Lots of holes to fill, short term guys signed as a stop-gap measure until the drafted guys develop...

[FatDT]

Am I the only one on here who reads what we are doing right now and thinking all of the posts sound just like they did when we got rid of Polian? Lots of holes to fill, short term guys signed as a stop-gap measure until the drafted guys develop...

Yes. The new GM is rebuilding a broken roster. Hopefully Ballard does a better job.

[VeveJones007]

Am I the only one on here who reads what we are doing right now and thinking all of the posts sound just like they did when we got rid of Polian? Lots of holes to fill, short term guys signed as a stop-gap measure until the drafted guys develop...

Those moves led to three straight 11 win seasons. Where Grigson failed was drafting the premium players to push the roster to the next level (and striking out miserably on the big ticket UFAs he went for in 2013-2015).

Ballard is laying a foundation, but it too will fail if he sucks at drafting. I don't think he will based on his track record, but we'll see.

[sherck]

Those moves led to three straight 11 win seasons. Where Grigson failed was drafting the premium players to push the roster to the next level (and striking out miserably on the big ticket UFAs he went for in 2013-2015).

Ballard is laying a foundation, but it too will fail if he sucks at drafting. I don't think he will based on his track record, but we'll see.
Ding, ding, ding. We have a winner!

I agree 100% with this post and it was worded much better than I would have.

Free agency brings short term stability. Long term success is through the draft.

I think Ballard has brought short term stability and if he can sign one of the ILBs, his work will be done prior to the draft, I think.

It is him finding studs in the draft that will lead to long term success; not signing veteran free agents.

Cheers,

[Brylok]

Jason La Canfora‏Verified account @JasonLaCanfora · 29m29 minutes ago

DB Darius Butler plans to re-sign with the Colts on a one-year deal today

:cool:
First good news I've heard today.

[smitty46953]

Free agent Kamar Aiken will visit the Colts on Friday. He'll also meet with the Seahawks on Monday.

:cool:

http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/7097/kamar-aiken

[omahacolt]

Ding, ding, ding. We have a winner!

I agree 100% with this post and it was worded much better than I would have.

Free agency brings short term stability. Long term success is through the draft.

I think Ballard has brought short term stability and if he can sign one of the ILBs, his work will be done prior to the draft, I think.

It is him finding studs in the draft that will lead to long term success; not signing veteran free agents.

Cheers,everyone agrees but there is no rule saying you can't improve your team on free agency.

[Brylok]

Free agent Kamar Aiken will visit the Colts on Friday. He'll also meet with the Seahawks on Monday.

:cool:

http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/7097/kamar-aiken
That's a good idea if the money is right. Won't have to use a draft pick on a WR.

[omahacolt]

That's a good idea if the money is right. Won't have to use a draft pick on a WR.

We don't have to use a draft pick on a wr regardless

[sherck]

That's a good idea if the money is right. Won't have to use a draft pick on a WR.
I like what I see.

Anyone know why he was a full time starter in 2015 and then only became a part time starter in 2016? He has targets in every game in 2016 so he was active and on the field but no longer a starter.

More competition for Dorsett, Rogers and perhaps Moncrief to keep developing. I like it.

Cheers,

[Racehorse]

Those moves led to three straight 11 win seasons. Where Grigson failed was drafting the premium players to push the roster to the next level (and striking out miserably on the big ticket UFAs he went for in 2013-2015).

Ballard is laying a foundation, but it too will fail if he sucks at drafting. I don't think he will based on his track record, but we'll see.

I am with you on all of that. I just had a very strong sense of deja vu going on in this thread. I hope Ballard is not Grigson 2.0.

[sherck]

I wonder how the free agent visit of NT John Jenkins is going? He is an actual 350 pound "true" 3-4 NT that would be good rotation with Al Woods to stabilize the position.

Interesting theme that I have seen run through Ballard's free agent signings or visits:

Former 1st round draft choice = Mingo
Former 2nd round draft choice = Sheard, Woods, Hunt, Kevin Minter (not signed)
Former 3rd round draft choice = John Jenkins (not signed)
Former 4th round draft choice = Simon, Schwenke

Its not like we are bringing in street free agents whom have not started many NFL games. Ballard is bringing in depth guys who had the athleticism to be drafted in the first 4 rounds of the draft in their year but who have underperformed during their rookie contracts.

The exception to that rule has been either re-signing our own (Doyle, Turbin, Butler), Special Teams (Locke - 5th round), and now WR Kamar Aiken who entered the league as a UDFA but who worked himself into a starting role in 2015.

Just an interesting connection point to the free agents. These are not "depth" free agent signings on par with signing the McNary's, Kerr's, Harrison's or Melton's of the world. These guys actually had talent or skills that they have not yet (or perhaps never will) unlock.

Cheers,

[Puck]

We don't have to use a draft pick on a wr regardless


I dont even know why he is looking for a WR unless he is planning to trade Dorsett. If you look at the mocks there are a few teams like the Bills that may take a WR so maybe we could move up trading away Dorsett.

[omahacolt]

I like what I see.

Anyone know why he was a full time starter in 2015 and then only became a part time starter in 2016? He has targets in every game in 2016 so he was active and on the field but no longer a starter.

More competition for Dorsett, Rogers and perhaps Moncrief to keep developing. I like it.

Cheers,

Steve smith was hurt. Also I think Perriman came back right?

[sherck]

I dont even know why he is looking for a WR unless he is planning to trade Dorsett. If you look at the mocks there are a few teams like the Bills that may take a WR so maybe we could move up trading away Dorsett.
The problem is that Dorsett has shown almost nothing in his time in the NFL to be worth much as trade bait.

50 targets per year, 25 receptions per year, 375 yards per year and 3 TDs total is not much to get other teams excited about his potential.

As an example, we got a 4th round pick for Allen AND had to give a 6th round pick as well. We did get cap relief in the deal but, overall, according to the "draft trade value chart," the 4th we got was worth 38 points and the 6th we gave away was worth 11 points for a "net" of 27 points for Allen equivalent to high 5th round draft choice.

BUF is picking #10 overall. To move from #15 to #10, it would take 250 points. Dwayne Allen only delivered 27 points...we need 9x that to make that trade.

Granted, if I am BUF and I see that I can trade one pick away (that I might have used on WR) to pick up a 3rd year former 1st round choice WR AND still have the #15 overall pick to use on a different position (or pick another WR), then perhaps I do that and I don't care about the "value."

But it takes ALOT to move up into the top ten of the NFL draft. Dorsett does not have that much value, I think.

Cheers,

[Spike]

The problem is that Dorsett has shown almost nothing in his time in the NFL to be worth much as trade bait.

50 targets per year, 25 receptions per year, 375 yards per year and 3 TDs total is not much to get other teams excited about his potential.

As an example, we got a 4th round pick for Allen AND had to give a 6th round pick as well. We did get cap relief in the deal but, overall, according to the "draft trade value chart," the 4th we got was worth 38 points and the 6th we gave away was worth 11 points for a "net" of 27 points for Allen equivalent to high 5th round draft choice.

BUF is picking #10 overall. To move from #15 to #10, it would take 250 points. Dwayne Allen only delivered 27 points...we need 9x that to make that trade.

Granted, if I am BUF and I see that I can trade one pick away (that I might have used on WR) to pick up a 3rd year former 1st round choice WR AND still have the #15 overall pick to use on a different position (or pick another WR), then perhaps I do that and I don't care about the "value."

But it takes ALOT to move up into the top ten of the NFL draft. Dorsett does not have that much value, I think.

Cheers,

Dorsett doesn't have much value at all. He's had Andrew fricken Luck as his QB and still hasn't been worth a shit. Another Grigson screw up.

[Puck]

Dorsett doesn't have much value at all. He's had Andrew fricken Luck as his QB and still hasn't been worth a shit. Another Grigson screw up.


He also has a bad OC calling plays for him

[Puck]

Richard Sherman anyone? I dont think he fits what we attempt to do

http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/seahawks-reportedly-open-to-trading-richard-sherman-%e2%80%98for-the-right-deal%e2%80%99/ar-BByeqdM?li=BBnba9I

[Brylok]

I dont even know why he is looking for a WR unless he is planning to trade Dorsett. If you look at the mocks there are a few teams like the Bills that may take a WR so maybe we could move up trading away Dorsett.
Isn't Aiken a KR guy, too? Maybe Quan Bray isn't long for the team.

[Indiana V2]

Richard Sherman anyone? I dont think he fits what we attempt to do

http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/seahawks-reportedly-open-to-trading-richard-sherman-%e2%80%98for-the-right-deal%e2%80%99/ar-BByeqdM?li=BBnba9I

This morning on the radio, not sure which station, they were saying if the Saints trade their 1st Round pick to the Patriots for Malcolm Butler, then expect the Patriots to then trade the pick for Sherman.

[VeveJones007]

everyone agrees but there is no rule saying you can't improve your team on free agency.

I agree with this, too. It isn't an either-or option. That being said, I think it's perfectly reasonable to not go crazy in 2017 UFA as you transition your roster, front office, and coaching staff. Ballard can lay the foundation now and then swing for the fences next offseason once he has his coach and scouts in place.

[VeveJones007]

He also has a bad OC calling plays for him

Dorsett isn't a good receiver. It doesn't matter what the play calls were.

[VeveJones007]

Isn't Aiken a KR guy, too? Maybe Quan Bray isn't long for the team.

Bigger possession receiver. They need another one. They need a guy to back up Moncrief.

[omahacolt]

Dorsett isn't a good receiver. It doesn't matter what the play calls were.

I say let's see him this year. I am not sure his book is written yet

[rcubed]

Bigger possession receiver. They need another one. They need a guy to back up Moncrief.
rogers

[sherck]

Richard Sherman anyone? I dont think he fits what we attempt to do

http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/seahawks-reportedly-open-to-trading-richard-sherman-%e2%80%98for-the-right-deal%e2%80%99/ar-BByeqdM?li=BBnba9I
Oh heck yes!

Sherman is a man-to-man stud who is not afraid to line up across from anyone and stay with them until the play is done.

Played in every game over his entire 6 season career and has started all of them since game 7 of his rookie year.

97 Passes Defended in 6 years. Average of 5 INTs per year and a really good run support tackler.

He is Vontae Davis....only 1 year younger. Would it not be great to have two of them?

A really nice page isolating him on some of his better plays from 2013 (located here (http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2013/9/20/4747480/richard-sherman-nfl-darelle-revis-seahawks-cornerback)).

Another one from 2014 that is more fact and data driven (located here (http://presnapreads.com/2014/02/19/richard-sherman-the-numbers-the-tape-the-verdict-2014/)).

Now, contracts.

Vontae is only signed through 2017 and is a free agent at the end of the season. He is our CB1 and would probably expect a top dollar offer from Ballard to remain here.

Sherman would cost the Colts $11.431m of cap space in 2017 and $11.000m in 2018. He would be great insurance against "needing" to overpay Vontae to stay. Those cap hits are not terrible when compared to what other top CBs are getting.

The rub comes down to what the Seahawks would want in return. I would pay a 3rd round pick in a heartbeat for him. I would think hard about paying our 2nd round pick since there was a solid chance we were going to use one of our 1st or 2nd round picks on CB anyway.

I would not trade our 1st round pick for him nor would I send multiple picks unless it was our 3rd round and one of our bottom 4th round picks.

Sherman would make our entire defense better. Add a OLB[RUSH] and ILB in the top rounds of the draft and our defensive makeover would be well underway.

Cheers,

[VeveJones007]

I say let's see him this year. I am not sure his book is written yet

His game speed is much slower than his 40. Doesn't create enough separation. Doesn't run crisp enough routes. Doesn't always catch cleanly. Doesn't attack the ball aggressively.

If there was anything special there, we would have seen it by now. I don't care what routes he's been running.

[rcubed]

Oh heck yes!

Sherman is a man-to-man stud who is not afraid to line up across from anyone and stay with them until the play is done.

Played in every game over his entire 6 season career and has started all of them since game 7 of his rookie year.

97 Passes Defended in 6 years. Average of 5 INTs per year and a really good run support tackler.

He is Vontae Davis....only 1 year younger. Would it not be great to have two of them?

A really nice page isolating him on some of his better plays from 2013 (located here (http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2013/9/20/4747480/richard-sherman-nfl-darelle-revis-seahawks-cornerback)).

Another one from 2014 that is more fact and data driven (located here (http://presnapreads.com/2014/02/19/richard-sherman-the-numbers-the-tape-the-verdict-2014/)).

Now, contracts.

Vontae is only signed through 2017 and is a free agent at the end of the season. He is our CB1 and would probably expect a top dollar offer from Ballard to remain here.

Sherman would cost the Colts $11.431m of cap space in 2017 and $11.000m in 2018. He would be great insurance against "needing" to overpay Vontae to stay. Those cap hits are not terrible when compared to what other top CBs are getting.

The rub comes down to what the Seahawks would want in return. I would pay a 3rd round pick in a heartbeat for him. I would think hard about paying our 2nd round pick since there was a solid chance we were going to use one of our 1st or 2nd round picks on CB anyway.

I would not trade our 1st round pick for him nor would I send multiple picks unless it was our 3rd round and one of our bottom 4th round picks.

Sherman would make our entire defense better. Add a OLB[RUSH] and ILB in the top rounds of the draft and our defensive makeover would be well underway.

Cheers,
I would do that. 3rd or 3rd and 5th.

[ukcolt]

Isn't Aiken a KR guy, too? Maybe Quan Bray isn't long for the team.

Looking at his stats he has never returned a punt or kickoff in the NFL, so i would say no he isn't going to be challenging Bray for this gig. Going to be competition for Rogers and maybe Dorsett. I would actually like to see us let Dorsett lose as a returner and see what he can do.

[omahacolt]

His game speed is much slower than his 40. Doesn't create enough separation. Doesn't run crisp enough routes. Doesn't always catch cleanly. Doesn't attack the ball aggressively.

If there was anything special there, we would have seen it by now. I don't care what routes he's been running.

I generally give wr's 3 years. I agree that I would have hoped to see more by now but I am still willing to give home this year.

[smitty46953]

Chicago Bears‏Verified account
@ChicagoBears

We have signed DL John Jenkins to a one-year contract.

Welcome to Chicago, @jenkinsjohn6!

:cool:

[smitty46953]

Reggie Wayne‏Verified account @ReggieWayne_17 · 1h1 hour ago

Reggie Wayne Retweeted Indianapolis Colts

Congrats @DariusJButler! That's a good move @Colts. Always made me work @ practice. Arguably best athlete/hands on the team. Now anyways ������

:cool:

[Brylok]

Chicago Bears‏Verified account
@ChicagoBears

We have signed DL John Jenkins to a one-year contract.

Welcome to Chicago, @jenkinsjohn6!

:cool:
That is a very large man.

[smitty46953]

That is a very large man.

Yes he is ... :cool:

[sherck]

Chicago Bears‏Verified account
@ChicagoBears

We have signed DL John Jenkins to a one-year contract.

Welcome to Chicago, @jenkinsjohn6!

:cool:
Darn, he never got out of Chicago.

Of course, I never get out of Chicago.......O'Hare airport. I hate that place.

Cheers,

[Wyatt]

I generally give wr's 3 years. I agree that I would have hoped to see more by now but I am still willing to give home this year.

except for Griff Whalen

[ukcolt]

Do we know what our current cap situation is now?
We have signed:-

C Brian Schwenke
DE Margus Hunt
DT Al Woods
OLB Jabaal Sheard
OLB John Simon
OLB Barkevious Mingo
and P Jeff Locke

A total of 7 guys so far, which makes it highly unlikely that we will get any sort of draft compensation come next year, as only 4 of our own free agents have currently signed with other teams, although obviously there is still time for some of the guys released to offset what we sign. We may not have finished with free agency ourselves so could end up adding another 1 or 2 names to the list.

[omahacolt]

except for Griff Whalen

Never heard of her

[sherck]

Do we know what our current cap situation is now?
We have signed:-

C Brian Schwenke
DE Margus Hunt
DT Al Woods
OLB Jabaal Sheard
OLB John Simon
OLB Barkevious Mingo
and P Jeff Locke

I did an update this morning in the "cap update" thread.

Roughly, we have $19m to spend on free agents left.

Cheers,

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[njcoltfan]

Oh heck yes!

Sherman is a man-to-man stud who is not afraid to line up across from anyone and stay with them until the play is done.

Played in every game over his entire 6 season career and has started all of them since game 7 of his rookie year.

97 Passes Defended in 6 years. Average of 5 INTs per year and a really good run support tackler.

He is Vontae Davis....only 1 year younger. Would it not be great to have two of them?

A really nice page isolating him on some of his better plays from 2013 (located here (http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2013/9/20/4747480/richard-sherman-nfl-darelle-revis-seahawks-cornerback)).

Another one from 2014 that is more fact and data driven (located here (http://presnapreads.com/2014/02/19/richard-sherman-the-numbers-the-tape-the-verdict-2014/)).

Now, contracts.

Vontae is only signed through 2017 and is a free agent at the end of the season. He is our CB1 and would probably expect a top dollar offer from Ballard to remain here.

Sherman would cost the Colts $11.431m of cap space in 2017 and $11.000m in 2018. He would be great insurance against "needing" to overpay Vontae to stay. Those cap hits are not terrible when compared to what other top CBs are getting.

The rub comes down to what the Seahawks would want in return. I would pay a 3rd round pick in a heartbeat for him. I would think hard about paying our 2nd round pick since there was a solid chance we were going to use one of our 1st or 2nd round picks on CB anyway.

I would not trade our 1st round pick for him nor would I send multiple picks unless it was our 3rd round and one of our bottom 4th round picks.

Sherman would make our entire defense better. Add a OLB[RUSH] and ILB in the top rounds of the draft and our defensive makeover would be well underway.

Cheers,

I don't understand why you are willing to pay 11M for a 28 yr old corner, but not 10M for a 24yr old NT that would instantly make the front 7 a team strength.

[sherck]

I don't understand why you are willing to pay 11M for a 28 yr old corner, but not 10M for a 24yr old NT that would instantly make the front 7 a team strength.
Because I am not as convinced as everyone else that Poe is still the difference maker he was 3 years ago.

I am convinced that Sherman is as good now as he has ever been.

You pay for uptrending or level excellence and not for declining performance.

Cheers,

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[njcoltfan]

Because I am not as convinced as everyone else that Poe is still the difference maker he was 3 years ago.

I am convinced that Sherman is as good now as he has ever been.

You pay for uptrending or level excellence and not for declining performance.

Cheers,

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

I wasn't talking about Poe he's signed, I was talking about Hankins. I would never sign Sherman, to me he's all about Richard Sherman, and not the team, and I absolutely would not give up any draft picks to acquire him, never.

[Coltsalr]

I would be beyond thrilled if we signed both Hankins and Zach Brown.

[sherck]

I wasn't talking about Poe he's signed, I was talking about Hankins. I would never sign Sherman, to me he's all about Richard Sherman, and not the team, and I absolutely would not give up any draft picks to acquire him, never.
Hankins might be worth a ton as a pass rushing 4-3 NT.

I am not positive why folks want to pay him a ton as a 3-4 NT. He is not that.

He might grow into the role, but paying $8m + a year to find out would be foolish.

Cheers,

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[njcoltfan]

Hankins might be worth a ton as a pass rushing 4-3 NT.

I am not positive why folks want to pay him a ton as a 3-4 NT. He is not that.

He might grow into the role, but paying $8m + a year to find out would be foolish.

Cheers,

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Ok, I can respect that point of view, but I still wouldn't give Sherman over 11m, and give up a high draft pick to get him, especially since the Colts can't pressure the QB.

[YDFL Commish]

Hankins might be worth a ton as a pass rushing 4-3 NT.

I am not positive why folks want to pay him a ton as a 3-4 NT. He is not that.

He might grow into the role, but paying $8m + a year to find out would be foolish.

Cheers,

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Yeah, that's too much for Hankins.

[natagu23]

Yeah, that's too much for Hankins.

Not really but what do i know.

[Dam8610]

Any news on Zach Brown? A bunch of articles from March 15 said the Colts were in contact with him, and that he left Oakland without signing, but not much beyond that. Hopefully the Colts are pursuing. Speed at the ILB position would be such a refreshing change.

[omahacolt]

Any news on Zach Brown? A bunch of articles from March 15 said the Colts were in contact with him, and that he left Oakland without signing, but not much beyond that. Hopefully the Colts are pursuing. Speed at the ILB position would be such a refreshing change.

what did you think of e jackson

[Dam8610]

what did you think of e jackson

Capable backup forced into a starter role. Could do well as a rotational player.

[indycolts2]

what did you think of e jackson

Besides playing out of control at times I love the energy he is bringing to the field. Lot of fun to watch and has good speed IMO, there are tools to work with regarding E Jackson.

[Spike]

Minter is gone, signed with the Bungles.

[YDFL Commish]

Besides playing out of control at times I love the energy he is bringing to the field. Lot of fun to watch and has good speed IMO, there are tools to work with regarding E Jackson.

I agree. He certainly outplayed Morrison. But he is undersized for the position, so unless he earns it by beating out whoever Ballard drafts at ILB, then he's best a reserve.

[smitty46953]

what did you think of e jackson

Midget who tries real hard ... :cool:

[smitty46953]

Bengals signed ILB Kevin Minter to a one-year contract. :cool:

http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/8443/kevin-minter

[Oldcolt]

It looks like Ballard saw this roster and thought it needed an almost complete remake. If you look at the roster as divided up into thirds he seem to think that you can fill out the middle third pretty effectively and with free agents. No real stars, but hopefully solid pieces. The top third already has a few players but desperately needs play makers. Play makers rarely make free agency and tend to break the bank. I'm hoping for pass rusher, pass rusher and more pass rushers. Throw in a cb if you can and we are on our way.

[Dam8610]

It looks like Ballard saw this roster and thought it needed an almost complete remake. If you look at the roster as divided up into thirds he seem to think that you can fill out the middle third pretty effectively and with free agents. No real stars, but hopefully solid pieces. The top third already has a few players but desperately needs play makers. Play makers rarely make free agency and tend to break the bank. I'm hoping for pass rusher, pass rusher and more pass rushers. Throw in a cb if you can and we are on our way.

It's a sound strategy. Hopefully it pays off.

[sherck]

It looks like Ballard saw this roster and thought it needed an almost complete remake. If you look at the roster as divided up into thirds he seem to think that you can fill out the middle third pretty effectively and with free agents. No real stars, but hopefully solid pieces. The top third already has a few players but desperately needs play makers. Play makers rarely make free agency and tend to break the bank. I'm hoping for pass rusher, pass rusher and more pass rushers. Throw in a cb if you can and we are on our way.
I feel similiar.

I keep using the word "stabilize" to describe our free agency model. Get each position up to NFL average and get your difference makers from the draft.

Hope it works.

Cheers,


Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[smitty46953]

Free agent TE Brandon Williams will visit the Colts.

Williams logged 149 snaps as the Seahawks' third-string tight end last season. The Colts are looking for depth behind Jack Doyle after trading Dwayne Allen to the Patriots. The 29-year-old has caught just six passes over four NFL seasons.

Related: Colts
Source: Jason La Canfora on Twitter
Mar 19 - 1:00 PM

:cool:

http://www.rotoworld.com/sports/nfl/football

[Brylok]

Free agent TE Brandon Williams will visit the Colts.

Williams logged 149 snaps as the Seahawks' third-string tight end last season. The Colts are looking for depth behind Jack Doyle after trading Dwayne Allen to the Patriots. The 29-year-old has caught just six passes over four NFL seasons.

Related: Colts
Source: Jason La Canfora on Twitter
Mar 19 - 1:00 PM

:cool:

http://www.rotoworld.com/sports/nfl/football
Veteran depth @ TE would be a good thing if the money is right (cheap).

[bertjones]

what did you think of e jackson

Like him as a backup. He's a high energy guy that you're glad to have on the team.

[VeveJones007]

The Colts can get out of all these UFA signings next year. This tells me that Pagano is all but done. Ballard is just filling out the roster while he focuses on the draft.

They'll have a similar amount of cap space next offseason to spend more freely in UFA after the new coaches and schemes are in place.

[Oldcolt]

The Colts can get out of all these UFA signings next year. This tells me that Pagano is all but done. Ballard is just filling out the roster while he focuses on the draft.

They'll have a similar amount of cap space next offseason to spend more freely in UFA after the new coaches and schemes are in place.

I don't get the logic. I agree that Ballard is filling out the roster and focused on the draft but how does that mean Pagano is gone. What would Ballard be doing differently if Pagano was going to stay?

[Wyatt]

@MyColtsAccount
Since March 9, Chris Ballard has signed 10 Free Agents for a total of $83.85M; about the same amount as Grigson gave Landry, RJF + Cherilus.

@MyColtsAccount 11h11 hours ago
(Apologies, should be 11 Free Agents: Schwenke, Turbin, Doyle, Hunt, Woods, Simon, Sheard, Mingo, Spence, Butler, Locke).

@MyColtsAccount 11h11 hours ago
Also worth noting that Chris Ballard has not guaranteed a single dollar to any of this year's Free Agents beyond 2017. Zero cap hit if cut.

[Wyatt]

@MyColtsAccount Mar 13
Colts Average Age in 2016: 26.52
(29th in NFL)Colts Average Age Today: 25.33*
(Would have ranked 3rd)
*Before adding younger draft picks.

@MyColtsAccount Mar 13
My Colts Account Retweeted Noah Rollings
Removing Vinatieri (age 44) from the current 63 players, Colts average age is 25.03, which would have been 2nd-youngest (Rams) in 2016.

[sherck]

@MyColtsAccount Mar 13
Colts Average Age in 2016: 26.52
(29th in NFL)Colts Average Age Today: 25.33*
(Would have ranked 3rd)
*Before adding younger draft picks.

@MyColtsAccount Mar 13
My Colts Account Retweeted Noah Rollings
Removing Vinatieri (age 44) from the current 63 players, Colts average age is 25.03, which would have been 2nd-youngest (Rams) in 2016.
Hmmmm, of course it makes us younger to remove guys like Mathis, Cole, Adams and Walden.

I think moving the average age by under 18 months is a bit to do about nothing. Yeah, we had some older players. Getting younger in its own right does not make us better, specifically. They still have to be the "right" younger players.

Cheers,

[sherck]

@MyColtsAccount
Since March 9, Chris Ballard has signed 10 Free Agents for a total of $83.85M; about the same amount as Grigson gave Landry, RJF + Cherilus.

@MyColtsAccount 11h11 hours ago
(Apologies, should be 11 Free Agents: Schwenke, Turbin, Doyle, Hunt, Woods, Simon, Sheard, Mingo, Spence, Butler, Locke).

@MyColtsAccount 11h11 hours ago
Also worth noting that Chris Ballard has not guaranteed a single dollar to any of this year's Free Agents beyond 2017. Zero cap hit if cut.
That certainly puts things into perspective.

When none of those three "high priced" free agents of Grigson's panned out, he had nothing to show for his free agency class.

A few of the guys whom Ballard signed are going to suck or not make the final 53 man roster (my money is on Mingo and Hunt). However, he might still have a "successful" free agency class because at least a couple of those other guys are going to be starters and contribute greatly in 2017.

On one hand, I can completely understand the folks who wanted "at least ONE" splash signing of a sure-fire, clear cut superior player in free agency. Doyle, Sheard or Simon are as close as we get to that and it would not surprise me if Schwenke ends up being a 16 game starter at right OG in 2017.

However, I also think that having filled many of our glaring needs with NFL "serviceable" veteran talent and still having $14m in free cap space to spend this off-season on veteran "surprise" cuts later in free agency is pretty brilliant.

While the "surprise" cuts will not be young like most of Ballard's free agents have been, many of them are still talented, can give a couple of years of stop-gap service to develop draftees and could end up doing a lot for our team.

I see both sides of the equation. I am so very interested to see what Ballard does in the draft and with the rest of free agency.

Cheers,

[Puck]

@MyColtsAccount
Since March 9, Chris Ballard has signed 10 Free Agents for a total of $83.85M; about the same amount as Grigson gave Landry, RJF + Cherilus.

@MyColtsAccount 11h11 hours ago
(Apologies, should be 11 Free Agents: Schwenke, Turbin, Doyle, Hunt, Woods, Simon, Sheard, Mingo, Spence, Butler, Locke).

@MyColtsAccount 11h11 hours ago
Also worth noting that Chris Ballard has not guaranteed a single dollar to any of this year's Free Agents beyond 2017. Zero cap hit if cut.


How is this possible when we only had 53 million or so available?

[Racehorse]

How is this possible when we only had 53 million or so available?

I think it is referring to total dollars over the life of the contract, or guaranteed dollars. Certainly, it is not a one-year number.

[sherck]

How is this possible when we only had 53 million or so available?
That $83m number is the total contract amount. The contracts for Doyle, Sheard and Simon count for almost all of the out-year amounts.

Cheers,

[Wyatt]

@pfrumors 57s57 seconds ago
Dolphins To Host LB Zach Brown On Visit

@caplannfl
LB Zach Brown to visit with #Dolphins today, per @OmarKelly. Raider and Brown were far apart on $$, sources said.

[Wyatt]

@Colts 1m1 minute ago
We have signed TE Brandon Williams

[GoBigBlue88]

Ballard out here signing a lot of JAGs. Which is whatever. Creating competition is his thing. But not holding out hope more than half of these guys even make the roster.

[sherck]

Ballard out here signing a lot of JAGs. Which is whatever. Creating competition is his thing. But not holding out hope more than half of these guys even make the roster.
I think that is unlikely.

Hunt is competing for DE5 with McGill but otherwise, the cupboard was pretty bare at most of the spots.

I think all but Hunt will make the 53 since our talent at signed positions was terrible.

Cheers,

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[natagu23]

I think that is unlikely.

Hunt is competing for DE5 with McGill but otherwise, the cupboard was pretty bare at most of the spots.

I think all but Hunt will make the 53 since our talent at signed positions was terrible.

Cheers,

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Competeing with McGill? There's no competition there.

An UDFA could probably beat out Hunt.

Ballard is just filling holes and going all in with the draft.

Most of the recent signees are not making the team except for Spence....maybe.

[ukcolt]

TE - Brandon Williams - Fighting for a roster spot as the third TE.
C/G - Brian Schwenke - Battling for the right guard spot, primary backup at C and G.
NT - Al Woods - In a competition with David Parry for the starting NT job.
DE - Margus Hunt - Will be in competition with T.Y. McGill and Arthur Jones along with any draft picks, but is renowned as a special teams ace, so probably has that as an advantage over both McGill and Jones.
OLB - Jabaal Sheard - Signed to be our starting OLB and primary pass rush specialist.
OLB - John Simon - Signed to be our starting OLB, with the hope that he will thrive given a chance of being a full time starter.
OLB - Barkevious Mingo - will be in a scrap for the 3rd, 4th or 5th OLB position with Ayers and any draft picks.
ILB - Sean Spence - will be one of our starters in the middle of our defense and should be the best coverage linebacker that we have had in possibly 10 years.
P - Jeff Locke - Almost sure fire starter.

So this free agency we have signed 3 certain defense starters, another guy who will see serious game time in a rotation at NT, and then the other guys are upgrades as backups with regards to anything that we have had in the past 5 years or so.

I like what we have done this offseason, you have to build your team through the draft, and add complimentary pieces to round out the roster.

[VeveJones007]

Ballard out here signing a lot of JAGs. Which is whatever. Creating competition is his thing. But not holding out hope more than half of these guys even make the roster.

Just filling out the roster in UFA, rolling over cap space to 2018 for the new coaches, schemes, etc.

These signings make it pretty apparent that Pagano is done.

[natagu23]

This is not the comprehensive strategy i was excepting trying to fill all the holes we have.

Again, if you're gonna go all-in with the draft as your sole way of retooling, you better nail your high picks.

[cq.noble]

Just filling out the roster in UFA, rolling over cap space to 2018 for the new coaches, schemes, etc.

These signings make it pretty apparent that Pagano is done.

Uhh... I want Pagano gone too but cap space has less than nothing to do with coaching changes. It's not like he's sandbagging the season, he's doing what he said he would do in not trying to build through free agency.

[omahacolt]

TE - Brandon Williams - Fighting for a roster spot as the third TE.
C/G - Brian Schwenke - Battling for the right guard spot, primary backup at C and G.
NT - Al Woods - In a competition with David Parry for the starting NT job.
DE - Margus Hunt - Will be in competition with T.Y. McGill and Arthur Jones along with any draft picks, but is renowned as a special teams ace, so probably has that as an advantage over both McGill and Jones.
OLB - Jabaal Sheard - Signed to be our starting OLB and primary pass rush specialist.
OLB - John Simon - Signed to be our starting OLB, with the hope that he will thrive given a chance of being a full time starter.
OLB - Barkevious Mingo - will be in a scrap for the 3rd, 4th or 5th OLB position with Ayers and any draft picks.
ILB - Sean Spence - will be one of our starters in the middle of our defense and should be the best coverage linebacker that we have had in possibly 10 years.
P - Jeff Locke - Almost sure fire starter.

So this free agency we have signed 3 certain defense starters, another guy who will see serious game time in a rotation at NT, and then the other guys are upgrades as backups with regards to anything that we have had in the past 5 years or so.

I like what we have done this offseason, you have to build your team through the draft, and add complimentary pieces to round out the roster.

"You have to build through the draft"

Doesn't mean you can't sign a difference maker in free agency. Not sure why people can't figure this out

[YDFL Commish]

"You have to build through the draft"

Doesn't mean you can't sign a difference maker in free agency. Not sure why people can't figure this out

How many true difference makers were there out there? Poe, Gilmore, Hightower....I dunno, you can dd on from there, but none of them move the needle for me.

The reality is, that as the salary cap increases there are far fewer cap strapped teams that can't sign their difference makers.

I hate to say it, but the current CBA, that Jeff Saturday helped to draft, is a disaster in many ways.

[GoBigBlue88]

"You have to build through the draft"

Doesn't mean you can't sign a difference maker in free agency. Not sure why people can't figure this out

I mean, hell, I'd rather have Alshon Jeffery at 1yr @ 8M than the combination of Schwenke, Woods, Williams and Hunt, personally.

[omahacolt]

How many true difference makers were there out there? Poe, Gilmore, Hightower....I dunno, you can dd on from there, but none of them move the needle for me.

The reality is, that as the salary cap increases there are far fewer cap strapped teams that can't sign their difference makers.

I hate to say it, but the current CBA, that Jeff Saturday helped to draft, is a disaster in many ways.

The dude spent 30 million and we have the same or more holes on the roster than last year.

[VeveJones007]

This is not the comprehensive strategy i was excepting trying to fill all the holes we have.

Again, if you're gonna go all-in with the draft as your sole way of retooling, you better nail your high picks.

Regardless of UFA, if you're going to consistently win in the NFL, you better nail your high picks.

Exhibit A:
Manning, Peyton
Harrison, Marvin
James, Edgerrin
Wayne, Reggie
Clark, Dallas
Glenn, Tarik
Freeney, Dwight
Sanders, Bob

[VeveJones007]

"You have to build through the draft"

Doesn't mean you can't sign a difference maker in free agency. Not sure why people can't figure this out

Very true. Which is part of the reason why I believe Ballard signed stopgaps for this season. You don't shoot your wad now if you might bring in a new coach who wants to run a different scheme. You save that money for next offseason.

[VeveJones007]

Uhh... I want Pagano gone too but cap space has less than nothing to do with coaching changes. It's not like he's sandbagging the season, he's doing what he said he would do in not trying to build through free agency.

Sandbagging is not representative of what I said. Ballard is signing stopgaps. That doesn't mean he isn't trying to be competitive this year.

[VeveJones007]

I mean, hell, I'd rather have Alshon Jeffery at 1yr @ 8M than the combination of Schwenke, Woods, Williams and Hunt, personally.

Ballard may agree with you. We don't know what he offered Jeffrey.

[Wyatt]

@PSchrags
Free agent TE Mychal Rivera is leaving his visit with Jets without signing a deal. Will visit with the Colts in Indy next. @gmfb @NFLonFOX

[Maniac]

Very true. Which is part of the reason why I believe Ballard signed stopgaps for this season. You don't shoot your wad now if you might bring in a new coach who wants to run a different scheme. You save that money for next offseason.

If that's true, then fire the moron already. I don't see someone intentionally signing average guys just to wait for the next head coach.

It was reported they tried to sign Poe, so it sounds like they DID try to go after at least one big name free agent. They may have tried to offer deals to others, we don't know what all is happening there.

[sherck]

If that's true, then fire the moron already. I don't see someone intentionally signing average guys just to wait for the next head coach.

It was reported they tried to sign Poe, so it sounds like they DID try to go after at least one big name free agent. They may have tried to offer deals to others, we don't know what all is happening there.

I think that the whole theory of "holding back" on free agency because of a potential new coach is not true at all. While we may be getting a new coach next year (I hope), Ballard has repeatedly told us that "you build through the draft" and that you cannot shortchange that process.

Someone said it earlier, free agency gets you short-term stability but drafting well gives you long-term success.

Grigson built a solid enough team through free agency to get us to three back-to-back-to-back 11-5 season but his terrible drafting then did not deliver long-term success (Werner, Richardson, D'Journ Smith, Dorsett).

You spend a wad on free agency to push you over the top. You don't spend it to get up to stable; you instead sign a bunch of guys who are NFL average or perhaps a bit better than that in lots of position groups and wait to find difference makers in the draft or by developing and retaining your own.

I think someone else's comment recently about how the rising salary cap allows teams to retain their own superstars better and I agree 100% with that.

IMO, there were 5 defensive "difference makers" in free agency that fit a 3-4 defensive scheme: Dontari Poe, Calais Campbell, Dont'a Hightower, Stephon Gilmore and A.J. Bouye. You could probably add Brandon Williams to that list but I don't know if he was a true difference maker.

Poe's best years may be behind him; his production has dropped since his 2014 season and he obviously wanted a lot of money and/or to play for a team much closer to being a contender. Currently, he is rep and not production. We had him in, we offered him what was probably a good long-term contract and he chose elsewhere. It happens.

Campbell is 30 years old. Spending $15m a year on a 30 year old defender is foolish.

Both Bouye and Gilmore would have been good signings, IMO. Davis is in his contract year and we obviously needed a CB2 this year that could become CB1 next year. I would have been good with signing one of them but that also would have contradicted Ballard's "you build up front" concept.

Williams? $10.5m a year to do what he does? Okay, it would have been great to get a NT of his caliber on 1st and 2nd downs but he bring little to the pass rush area and he is getting paid pass rush money. His cap hit is "cheap" at $6m a year but is $11.75m $11.75m, and $12.00m in the final 3 years. No thanks.

Zach Brown? 2 year starter in a 4-3 defense followed by 2 years of injury and little play followed by 2016 where he killed it. Sure-fire difference maker?

Chris Baker? Logan Ryan? Tony Jefferson? Who else was a difference maker?



Lots of folks are complaining not so much about what Ballard has done but moreso that we did not sign "one impact guy" on defense.

Which of those guys would you have spent the money on? We tried Poe and it did not work. Perhaps one of the CBs would have been good given our situation but Ballard obviously did not want the pay that money at the back end yet.

Anyway, I agree that we did not "throw" free agency due to an upcoming coaching change. This appears to be Ballard's plan.

Draft the top 1/3 of your roster
Free Agent the middle 1/3 of your roster
Fill in UDFA/Street the bottom 1/3 of your roster

Cheers,

[sherck]

@PSchrags
Free agent TE Mychal Rivera is leaving his visit with Jets without signing a deal. Will visit with the Colts in Indy next. @gmfb @NFLonFOX
I like him. 6th round draft pick of the Raiders in 2013. In 4 seasons:

61 games played / 15 games started / 230 targets / 146 receptions / 63.5% catch rate / 1,413 receiving yards / 10 TD

It appears that he played extensively in his first two years with his 2nd season in 2014 being tops in being targeted 99 times. His targets, however, dropped to 46 in 2015 and only 25 in 2016. This blog from Raiders land tells the tale:
2014 was also a good year for Rivera, the first one with Derek Carr at the helm. Again, Rivera played in all 16 games, finishing with 58 receptions for 534 yards and 4 TDs, while maintaining a quality average at 9.2 yards per catch.

But Rivera has always had a flaw, which can be fatal for a tight end — poor blocking. And then things started to go south for him in 2015 when the Raiders drafted Clive Walford. At 6’4″ and 250 pounds, Walford was supposed to be a much better blocker than Rivera while having similar receiving ability.

At the same time, alongside Walford, the Raiders brought in Lee Smith, a primarily blocking tight end, but a damn good one at that.

Lee quickly took over the starting job — particularly due to Jack Del Rio’s willingness to run the ball more — and Walford was plugged in passing situations. Rivera was the odd man out, fading into darkness. He finished that year with 32 receptions, 280 years and a single TD — much lower numbers compared to his rookie year stats.

This trend continued into 2016. Rivera wasn’t even active in multiple games, which was a really bad sign. But a season-ending injury to Smith opened the door for Rivera at least to suit up on game days again. Walford was still the starting tight end, but he did not pan out the way the Raiders hoped.
Our TE coaches have shown that they can develop TEs. Both Doyle and Swoope have come a long way over the past couple of seasons.

Rivera sounds like a guy that has the ability to succeed, he just needs the coaching and the change to do so. With the Colts playing a lot of 2TE sets, he will get the chance here.

Sign him and the Colts have zero need to look at TE in the draft. The other free agent we signed, Brandon Williams, sounds much more like a Special Teams guy that someone who we think can develop into an offensive weapon. I don't mind him as TE4 but I would like Rivera much better as battling for TE2 duties with Swoope.

Cheers,

[Offensive Lineman]

"You have to build through the draft"

Doesn't mean you can't sign a difference maker in free agency. Not sure why people can't figure this out

It seems to me that by upgrading positions of need to just NFL average skill - when those positions were manned by less than average talent (unless you want to argue that Trent Cole is a better player than John Simon) - you are in fact signing 'impact' players because they will raise the overall talent level of the team. They are not 'name' impact players, I grant you that. But they are experienced players that still have upside that are looking to make a bigger contribution than they were making with their old teams, so I would expect the overall competition level to ratchet up quite a bit, thus making an 'impact'. Would I have loved to land a corner like Bouye? Absolutely. But not at the expense of being unable to address the many needs our talent deficient roster had. The sort of impact player you are looking for is found through the draft. That's where Ballard's strategy will be won or lost, not because some big dollar FA didn't sign here. Just my thought anyway.

[FatDT]

IMO, there were 5 defensive "difference makers" in free agency that fit a 3-4 defensive scheme: Dontari Poe, Calais Campbell, Dont'a Hightower, Stephon Gilmore and A.J. Bouye. You could probably add Brandon Williams to that list but I don't know if he was a true difference maker.

I wouldn't even put Bouye on that list. He's a one year starter in a contract year. Reminds me of Alteraun Verner. Tried hard for a year when opposing teams weren't expecting him to be any good. I doubt he ends up worth the contract Jacksonville gave him.

From what I've read/heard Hightower went to see other teams so he could come back to NE with a market-set price to agree on. He never wanted to leave. The Jets offered him $2M more per year than he got with the Pats. He was never going to sign here.

[Puck]

I think it goes back to what I said a while back. Your draft picks take a yr or two to get up to NFL readiness.... not all of them i.e. Kelly... but for the most part as you have players hit FA you have players behind them that were drafted to take their spots. But because of the terrible drafting/draft class of 2013 and poor decision making by Grigson for the most part, there isn't any of those guys to step up so we have to add a lot of players in a lot of positions with this FA period to fill voids. Then you can start building through the draft.

Contrary to what everyone thinks we are not that far off from winning the division. Save a couple of stupid coaching decisions and we win that division last yr.

I think Simon is going to be very good. I like the Spence signing maybe more than most of you do. And I think Sheard and even Mingo will be good transition players to give the draft picks time to develope.

[Puck]

If that's true, then fire the moron already. I don't see someone intentionally signing average guys just to wait for the next head coach.

It was reported they tried to sign Poe, so it sounds like they DID try to go after at least one big name free agent. They may have tried to offer deals to others, we don't know what all is happening there.

If he is waiting then this is just dumb. The team is being built for a Pagano D and if they have any thoughts of changing that could mean an entire rebuild in a different direction next yr.

I don't' think they have any plans to get rid of Pagano..... until he starts the bad game management BS again this yr.

[Wyatt]

@RapSheet
Former #Ravens WR Kamar Aiken is expected to sign with the #Colts, source said. A forgotten man in Baltimore with a new home.

[GoBigBlue88]

Now Aiken is a signing I can get a little excited about. Buying low on decent upside WR who was limited by Joe Flacco's Captain Checkdown offense. Really shined in 2015. Down year (in line w/ Flacco's down year) in 2016. But if you ask any Ravens fan or really even watch any highlights package, this guy is a red zone/possession ace. He's not gonna burn you with speed (Colts have enough of those guys), but strong hands and big, athletic frame.

He's a guy who should help out the Colts a ton in the red zone and in 3rd down packages.

[HoosierinFL]

Aiken is by far the best free agent WR we've ever brought in, that I can remember.
Grigson's guys were all problematic in various ways or had been injured. Avery, DHB, that other guy. Aiken is starter level who was def just a forgotten guy in Baltimore.

[Maniac]

I think that the whole theory of "holding back" on free agency because of a potential new coach is not true at all. While we may be getting a new coach next year (I hope), Ballard has repeatedly told us that "you build through the draft" and that you cannot shortchange that process.

Someone said it earlier, free agency gets you short-term stability but drafting well gives you long-term success.

Grigson built a solid enough team through free agency to get us to three back-to-back-to-back 11-5 season but his terrible drafting then did not deliver long-term success (Werner, Richardson, D'Journ Smith, Dorsett).

You spend a wad on free agency to push you over the top. You don't spend it to get up to stable; you instead sign a bunch of guys who are NFL average or perhaps a bit better than that in lots of position groups and wait to find difference makers in the draft or by developing and retaining your own.

I think someone else's comment recently about how the rising salary cap allows teams to retain their own superstars better and I agree 100% with that.

IMO, there were 5 defensive "difference makers" in free agency that fit a 3-4 defensive scheme: Dontari Poe, Calais Campbell, Dont'a Hightower, Stephon Gilmore and A.J. Bouye. You could probably add Brandon Williams to that list but I don't know if he was a true difference maker.

Poe's best years may be behind him; his production has dropped since his 2014 season and he obviously wanted a lot of money and/or to play for a team much closer to being a contender. Currently, he is rep and not production. We had him in, we offered him what was probably a good long-term contract and he chose elsewhere. It happens.

Campbell is 30 years old. Spending $15m a year on a 30 year old defender is foolish.

Both Bouye and Gilmore would have been good signings, IMO. Davis is in his contract year and we obviously needed a CB2 this year that could become CB1 next year. I would have been good with signing one of them but that also would have contradicted Ballard's "you build up front" concept.

Williams? $10.5m a year to do what he does? Okay, it would have been great to get a NT of his caliber on 1st and 2nd downs but he bring little to the pass rush area and he is getting paid pass rush money. His cap hit is "cheap" at $6m a year but is $11.75m $11.75m, and $12.00m in the final 3 years. No thanks.

Zach Brown? 2 year starter in a 4-3 defense followed by 2 years of injury and little play followed by 2016 where he killed it. Sure-fire difference maker?

Chris Baker? Logan Ryan? Tony Jefferson? Who else was a difference maker?



Lots of folks are complaining not so much about what Ballard has done but moreso that we did not sign "one impact guy" on defense.

Which of those guys would you have spent the money on? We tried Poe and it did not work. Perhaps one of the CBs would have been good given our situation but Ballard obviously did not want the pay that money at the back end yet.

Anyway, I agree that we did not "throw" free agency due to an upcoming coaching change. This appears to be Ballard's plan.

Draft the top 1/3 of your roster
Free Agent the middle 1/3 of your roster
Fill in UDFA/Street the bottom 1/3 of your roster

Cheers,

Excellent post!

[Maniac]

Now Aiken is a signing I can get a little excited about. Buying low on decent upside WR who was limited by Joe Flacco's Captain Checkdown offense. Really shined in 2015. Down year (in line w/ Flacco's down year) in 2016. But if you ask any Ravens fan or really even watch any highlights package, this guy is a red zone/possession ace. He's not gonna burn you with speed (Colts have enough of those guys), but strong hands and big, athletic frame.

He's a guy who should help out the Colts a ton in the red zone and in 3rd down packages.

I agree. I really like the Aiken signing.

[Puck]

I really wish they would bring in Jared Odrick. He was playing well until he hurt his elbow last yr. Could be a great upgrade at DE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMC0cvucTok

[sherck]

Colts WRs:
5 seasons / 78 games played / 57 games started / 649 targets / 374 receptions / 57.6% catch rate / 5,861 yards / 15.7 average / 30 TD / 5’10”, 183 lbs / T.Y. Hilton
5 seasons / 51 games played / 20 games started / 209 targets / 128 receptions / 61.2% catch rate / 1,539 yards / 12.0 average / 09 TD / 6’02”, 213 lbs / Kamar Aiken
3 seasons / 41 games played / 19 games started / 210 targets / 126 receptions / 60.0% catch rate / 1,484 yards / 11.8 average / 16 TD / 6’02”, 221 lbs / Donte Moncrief
2 seasons / 26 games played / 07 games started / 098 targets / 051 receptions / 52.0% catch rate / 0,753 yards / 14.8 average / 03 TD / 5’10”, 183 lbs / Phillip Dorsett
1 seasons / 14 games played / 02 games started / 034 targets / 019 receptions / 55.9% catch rate / 0,273 yards / 14.4 average / 00 TD / 6’01”, 187 lbs / Chester Rogers

Colts TEs:
4 seasons / 63 games played / 21 games started / 118 targets / 094 receptions / 79.7% catch rate / 0,793 yards / 08.4 average / 08 TD / 6’05”, 254 lbs / Jack Doyle
4 seasons / 61 games played / 15 games started / 230 targets / 146 receptions / 63.5% catch rate / 1,413 yards / 09.7 average / 10 TD / 6’03”, 242 lbs / Mychal Rivera**
2 seasons / 17 games played / 04 games started / 022 targets / 015 receptions / 68.2% catch rate / 0,297 yards / 19.8 average / 01 TD / 6’05”, 246 lbs / Erik Swoope
4 seasons / 45 games played / 01 games started / 011 targets / 006 receptions / 54.5% catch rate / 0,080 yards / 13.3 average / 00 TD / 6’04”, 255 lbs / B. Williams

** Obviously, Rivera is not signed but those are his stats showing that he has about the same play time as Doyle and has been thrown at a WHOLE lot more than Doyle was.

[NOTE: I am NOT saying that Aiken is WR2. That is Moncrief's job to lose. I am saying that Aiken has a nice amount of playing experience when compared to our other WRs not named Hilton.]

That would be a pretty nice pass catching group for Andrew in 2017. Young, but nice. No need for any attention at WR or TE unless BPA is just too unbelievable.

Cheers,

[sherck]

I really wish they would bring in Jared Odrick. He was playing well until he hurt his elbow last yr. Could be a great upgrade at DE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMC0cvucTok
The main issue being is that he has only ever played as a 4-3 Undertackle playing in a 1-gap system both at MIA and JAX.

I am not positive that his skills translate into a 3-4 2-gap 5-tech DE well.

Cheers,

[VeveJones007]

I think that the whole theory of "holding back" on free agency because of a potential new coach is not true at all. While we may be getting a new coach next year (I hope), Ballard has repeatedly told us that "you build through the draft" and that you cannot shortchange that process.

Someone said it earlier, free agency gets you short-term stability but drafting well gives you long-term success.

Grigson built a solid enough team through free agency to get us to three back-to-back-to-back 11-5 season but his terrible drafting then did not deliver long-term success (Werner, Richardson, D'Journ Smith, Dorsett).

You spend a wad on free agency to push you over the top. You don't spend it to get up to stable; you instead sign a bunch of guys who are NFL average or perhaps a bit better than that in lots of position groups and wait to find difference makers in the draft or by developing and retaining your own.

I think someone else's comment recently about how the rising salary cap allows teams to retain their own superstars better and I agree 100% with that.

IMO, there were 5 defensive "difference makers" in free agency that fit a 3-4 defensive scheme: Dontari Poe, Calais Campbell, Dont'a Hightower, Stephon Gilmore and A.J. Bouye. You could probably add Brandon Williams to that list but I don't know if he was a true difference maker.

Poe's best years may be behind him; his production has dropped since his 2014 season and he obviously wanted a lot of money and/or to play for a team much closer to being a contender. Currently, he is rep and not production. We had him in, we offered him what was probably a good long-term contract and he chose elsewhere. It happens.

Campbell is 30 years old. Spending $15m a year on a 30 year old defender is foolish.

Both Bouye and Gilmore would have been good signings, IMO. Davis is in his contract year and we obviously needed a CB2 this year that could become CB1 next year. I would have been good with signing one of them but that also would have contradicted Ballard's "you build up front" concept.

Williams? $10.5m a year to do what he does? Okay, it would have been great to get a NT of his caliber on 1st and 2nd downs but he bring little to the pass rush area and he is getting paid pass rush money. His cap hit is "cheap" at $6m a year but is $11.75m $11.75m, and $12.00m in the final 3 years. No thanks.

Zach Brown? 2 year starter in a 4-3 defense followed by 2 years of injury and little play followed by 2016 where he killed it. Sure-fire difference maker?

Chris Baker? Logan Ryan? Tony Jefferson? Who else was a difference maker?



Lots of folks are complaining not so much about what Ballard has done but moreso that we did not sign "one impact guy" on defense.

Which of those guys would you have spent the money on? We tried Poe and it did not work. Perhaps one of the CBs would have been good given our situation but Ballard obviously did not want the pay that money at the back end yet.

Anyway, I agree that we did not "throw" free agency due to an upcoming coaching change. This appears to be Ballard's plan.

Draft the top 1/3 of your roster
Free Agent the middle 1/3 of your roster
Fill in UDFA/Street the bottom 1/3 of your roster

Cheers,

FWIW, I agree with this. What you said here and what I've said in this thread are not mutually exclusive.

[Puck]

The main issue being is that he has only ever played as a 4-3 Undertackle playing in a 1-gap system both at MIA and JAX.

I am not positive that his skills translate into a 3-4 2-gap 5-tech DE well.

Cheers,


Ian Rapoport‏Verified account @RapSheet (https://twitter.com/RapSheet)

FA DE Jared Odrick, who passed a physical on his #Patriots (https://twitter.com/hashtag/Patriots?src=hash) visit, is one to watch on if #Giants (https://twitter.com/hashtag/Giants?src=hash) don’t get Hankins back. He’ll take visits


If he is possibly replacing Hankins he would fit...if we are interested in Hankins....


http://nep.247sports.com/Bolt/Report-Free-agent-Jared-Odrick-is-a-name-to-watch-for-Giants-51881071

[smitty46953]

I agree. I really like the Aiken signing.

He should be a good one with your blessing ... :cool:

[Wyatt]

@pfrumors
Linebacker Zach Brown Fires Agent http://www.profootballrumors.com/2017/03/linebacker-zach-brown-fires-agent …

[sherck]

@pfrumors
Linebacker Zach Brown Fires Agent http://www.profootballrumors.com/2017/03/linebacker-zach-brown-fires-agent …

Brown: "Why am I not getting the money I want? I want Hightower money!"

Agent: "Well, the market softened. No one else is willing to pay that."

Brown: "Why am I not getting the money I want? I want Hightower money!"

Agent: "Ummm.....well, how about a one year prove it deal?"

Brown: "Why am I not getting the money I want? I want Hightower money!"

Agent: "Wait a minute. Is this a recording? The market softened!"

Brown: "Why am I not getting the money I want? I want Hightower money!"

Agent: "Gahhhhhh, I hate prima-donnas. Why do I get prima-donnas?"

Brown: "Your fired."

Agent: "Hello! Welcome to Sports Representation R Us! We are glad you are here."

Brown: "Why am I not getting the money I want? I want Hightower money!"






Cheers,