2017 Draft Thread

[Coltsalr]

Originally Posted by Puck

Butler is a safety. Not Nicole corner anymore

Would not be surprised if he slides in to cover the slot guys on 3rd downs. Just sayin.

[Puck]

Originally Posted by Coltsalr

Would not be surprised if he slides in to cover the slot guys on 3rd downs. Just sayin.

I doubt that happens. Never saw Adams doing it... who would play safety? Green? Seems smarter to actually have a CB instead of trying to put a bandaid on one spot

I distinctly remember you complaining about Toler on a weekly basis. If you were not ok with it then not sure how you would be ok going back to that same scenario. Without a starting caliber CB opposite VD it will be ugly. And when or if VD goes down it will be even uglier. No pass rush would over come a tandem of Melvin and Mitchell. Or even Melvin and Butler if it got that desperate

Just remember pass rush and LBR has been addressed. Maybe not with 4 pro bowlers but it has been upgraded.... CB has not been. In fact it is less than last season. I don't know about you, but IMO that is a huge huge hole on this team. Easily the biggest on the team.

[Coltsalr]

Originally Posted by Puck

I doubt that happens. Never saw Adams doing it... who would play safety? Green? Seems smarter to actually have a CB instead of trying to put a bandaid on one spot

I distinctly remember you complaining about Toler on a weekly basis. If you were not ok with it then not sure how you would be ok going back to that same scenario. Without a starting caliber CB opposite VD it will be ugly. And when or if VD goes down it will be even uglier. No pass rush would over come a tandem of Melvin and Mitchell. Or even Melvin and Butler if it got that desperate

Just remember pass rush and LBR has been addressed. Maybe not with 4 pro bowlers but it has been upgraded.... CB has not been. In fact it is less than last season. I don't know about you, but IMO that is a huge huge hole on this team. Easily the biggest on the team.

I don't think you understand how dire the LB problem is.

Did you like, watch Antonio Morrison last year and think he was, um, good? Because either he or Edwin Jackson is currently slated to start at LB. That's a fairly massive problem.

[apballin]

Originally Posted by Coltsalr

I don't think you understand how dire the LB problem is.

Did you like, watch Antonio Morrison last year and think he was, um, good? Because either he or Edwin Jackson is currently slated to start at LB. That's a fairly massive problem.

I liked what Jackson brought last season unless Foster falls in our lap, it wouldn't surprise me if Jackson and Spence are the starters

[Puck]

Originally Posted by Coltsalr

I don't think you understand how dire the LB problem is.

Did you like, watch Antonio Morrison last year and think he was, um, good? Because either he or Edwin Jackson is currently slated to start at LB. That's a fairly massive problem.

I don't think you understand that they have already upgraded the LB positons. We only have 1 starting CB on the roster.

[sherck]

The more I look at film, the more that I am becoming convinced that I don't see a big difference between the OLBs after Myles Garrett ranking from about #2 through #15 or so.

I mean, who is the #2? Reddick? Harris? Willis?

Who is the #8? Who is #12?

I think that different teams are going to value a lot of different traits in these kids. I personally think that T.J. Watt could become the best of the lot BUT I also acknowledge that there is a lot of downside to him as well that could lead to a bust. It is that kind of class.

They all have talent and production. There are going to be some really good pass rushers that come out of this class but I am not convinced that the kids taken in the middle of the 1st round have that much more going for them than the kids whom are going to be taken in the middle of the 2nd round or possible even taken in the middle of the 3rd round. I like Ryan Anderson, Alabama (whom many think is a 3rd round pick) and Trey Hendrickson, Florida Atlantic (again, whom many think is 3rd round or below) about as well as I like Harris or Watt or Bowser.

As such, I am now throwing my considerable weight (alas, physical and not reputation) behind the concept of drafting CB in the 1st round instead of OLB and waiting until later to draft LB.

As Puck keeps pointing out, "who is going to play CB?" The answer probably needs to be one of:

6'00" / 195lbs / 4.44s 40 / 11 bench / 37.0" vertical / 129.0" broad / 6.68s 3 cone / 4.18s 20 shuttle / Gareon Conley, Ohio State
5'11"/ 192lbs / 4.47s 40 / 16 bench / 32.0" vertical / 119.0" broad / 6.90s 3 cone / 4.32s 20 shuttle / Tre'Darvious White, LSU

I prefer Conley because he is the better athlete, played more press coverage in college and just "looks" more NFL ready right now. I am not so sure that White will not be the better CB in the long run after a season or two of seasoning but, alas, the Colts are in need of a starter RIGHT NOW instead of in a season or two.

Once we get our CB2 in the 1st round, we could then come back at 2-14 (#46) and 3-16 (#80) and go ILB/OLB depending on who has best BPA. Guys like this could/should be available:

OLB Tarell Basham, Ohio (small school and raw but talented)
OLB Tim Williams, Alabama (how far is he going to fall?)
OLB Tyus Bowser, Houston (+ physical that is still very raw)
OLB Ryan Anderson, Alabama (+ production but lack physical upside)
OLB Trey Hendrickson, Florida Atlantic (+ production, + physical, SMALL school)
OLB Daeshon Hall, Texas A&M (DE position switch, pure pass rusher)

ILB Alex Anzalone, Florida (+ physical and production, has been inured a lot)
ILB Raekwon McMillian, Ohio State (solid coverage, needs to improve run support)
ILB Anthony Walker Jr, Northwestern (+ run play, only okay in coverage)
ILB Duke Riley, LSU (1 year of production but improving, solid all around)
ILB Blair Brown, Ohio (1 year of production; small school)

The ILB class really seems to fall off after the likes of Foster, Reddick (if folks view him as an ILB), Davis and Cunningham. My BPA for 2-14 would probably be one of Davis or Cunningham if they fall that far and then OLB if they don't.

The likes of Trey Hendrickson, Daeshon Hall or Ryan Anderson might still be around for our 3rd round pick and would add another solid body in our OLB rotation; not a world beater but a solid body.

===============
TLR

1-15:
A pick = CB Gareon Conley
B pick = CB Tre'Darvious White

2-14:
A pick = ILB Jarrad Davis or ILB Zach Cunningham (if they slide)
B pick = OLB Charles Harris or OLB T.J. Watt (if they slide)
C pick = ILB Raekwon McMillian
D pick = OLB Tim Williams

3-16:
A pick = OLB Ryan Anderson (if ILB was taken in 2nd round)
B pick = OLB Trey Hendrickson (if ILB was taken in 2nd round)
C pick = ILB Duke Riley or ILB Blair Brown

4th round CB (Witherspoon? Kazee? Elder? Griffin?)
4th round RB
4th round Safety
5th round TE

Add a veteran CB in free agency from camp cut to push the rookie 1st round draft pick to perform and you have a full wrap on it.

Cheers,

[Puck]

Originally Posted by sherck

The more I look at film, the more that I am becoming convinced that I don't see a big difference between the OLBs after Myles Garrett ranking from about #2 through #15 or so.

I mean, who is the #2? Reddick? Harris? Willis?

Who is the #8? Who is #12?

I think that different teams are going to value a lot of different traits in these kids. I personally think that T.J. Watt could become the best of the lot BUT I also acknowledge that there is a lot of downside to him as well that could lead to a bust. It is that kind of class.

They all have talent and production. There are going to be some really good pass rushers that come out of this class but I am not convinced that the kids taken in the middle of the 1st round have that much more going for them than the kids whom are going to be taken in the middle of the 2nd round or possible even taken in the middle of the 3rd round. I like Ryan Anderson, Alabama (whom many think is a 3rd round pick) and Trey Hendrickson, Florida Atlantic (again, whom many think is 3rd round or below) about as well as I like Harris or Watt or Bowser.

As such, I am now throwing my considerable weight (alas, physical and not reputation) behind the concept of drafting CB in the 1st round instead of OLB and waiting until later to draft LB.

As Puck keeps pointing out, "who is going to play CB?" The answer probably needs to be one of:

6'00" / 195lbs / 4.44s 40 / 11 bench / 37.0" vertical / 129.0" broad / 6.68s 3 cone / 4.18s 20 shuttle / Gareon Conley, Ohio State
5'11"/ 192lbs / 4.47s 40 / 16 bench / 32.0" vertical / 119.0" broad / 6.90s 3 cone / 4.32s 20 shuttle / Tre'Darvious White, LSU

I prefer Conley because he is the better athlete, played more press coverage in college and just "looks" more NFL ready right now. I am not so sure that White will not be the better CB in the long run after a season or two of seasoning but, alas, the Colts are in need of a starter RIGHT NOW instead of in a season or two.

Once we get our CB2 in the 1st round, we could then come back at 2-14 (#46) and 3-16 (#80) and go ILB/OLB depending on who has best BPA. Guys like this could/should be available:

OLB Tarell Basham, Ohio (small school and raw but talented)
OLB Tim Williams, Alabama (how far is he going to fall?)
OLB Tyus Bowser, Houston (+ physical that is still very raw)
OLB Ryan Anderson, Alabama (+ production but lack physical upside)
OLB Trey Hendrickson, Florida Atlantic (+ production, + physical, SMALL school)
OLB Daeshon Hall, Texas A&M (DE position switch, pure pass rusher)

ILB Alex Anzalone, Florida (+ physical and production, has been inured a lot)
ILB Raekwon McMillian, Ohio State (solid coverage, needs to improve run support)
ILB Anthony Walker Jr, Northwestern (+ run play, only okay in coverage)
ILB Duke Riley, LSU (1 year of production but improving, solid all around)
ILB Blair Brown, Ohio (1 year of production; small school)

The ILB class really seems to fall off after the likes of Foster, Reddick (if folks view him as an ILB), Davis and Cunningham. My BPA for 2-14 would probably be one of Davis or Cunningham if they fall that far and then OLB if they don't.

The likes of Trey Hendrickson, Daeshon Hall or Ryan Anderson might still be around for our 3rd round pick and would add another solid body in our OLB rotation; not a world beater but a solid body.

===============
TLR

1-15:
A pick = CB Gareon Conley
B pick = CB Tre'Darvious White

2-14:
A pick = ILB Jarrad Davis or ILB Zach Cunningham (if they slide)
B pick = OLB Charles Harris or OLB T.J. Watt (if they slide)
C pick = ILB Raekwon McMillian
D pick = OLB Tim Williams

3-16:
A pick = OLB Ryan Anderson (if ILB was taken in 2nd round)
B pick = OLB Trey Hendrickson (if ILB was taken in 2nd round)
C pick = ILB Duke Riley or ILB Blair Brown

4th round CB (Witherspoon? Kazee? Elder? Griffin?)
4th round RB
4th round Safety
5th round TE

Add a veteran CB in free agency from camp cut to push the rookie 1st round draft pick to perform and you have a full wrap on it.

Cheers,

Yep. That's why I have no idea who they are taking in round one. If Fournette or Howard falls. They will most likely be BPA

I want Lamp but he won't be BPA. So he won't be the pick. I hope they can get Jones in the second or third. Before his injury he was probably top 7-8 of BPA.

I Do think Ballard picks up at least 2 FA cbs


FA for need Draft BPA

[Coltsalr]

Originally Posted by Puck

I don't think you understand that they have already upgraded the LB positons. We only have 1 starting CB on the roster.

Melvin is a better starter than Morrison/Jackson.

If you can't see that, I can't help you.

[Wyatt]

Originally Posted by Puck

I doubt that happens. Never saw Adams doing it... who would play safety? Green? Seems smarter to actually have a CB instead of trying to put a bandaid on one spot

I distinctly remember you complaining about Toler on a weekly basis. If you were not ok with it then not sure how you would be ok going back to that same scenario. Without a starting caliber CB opposite VD it will be ugly. And when or if VD goes down it will be even uglier. No pass rush would over come a tandem of Melvin and Mitchell. Or even Melvin and Butler if it got that desperate

Just remember pass rush and LBR has been addressed. Maybe not with 4 pro bowlers but it has been upgraded.... CB has not been. In fact it is less than last season. I don't know about you, but IMO that is a huge huge hole on this team. Easily the biggest on the team.

Speaking of washed up CB's from the past, I see Powers retired over the weekend

[FatDT]

I would be ok drafting a CB if he's the BPA. But I also see guys out there like Jason McCourty, Sam Shields, Brandon Flowers, Alteraun Verner, and even Leon Hall out there looking for work. Any of them could step in and start opposite Davis. I would not want to limit the team to just one position in the 1st. Lots of areas on defense, and even maybe the OL, could stand to have talent added. CB would be an emergency if there were no viable FAs available, but there are several.