Before we discard Kelly and Smith, consider…

[HoosierinFL]

I'd keep Kelly but Smith is very expensive and just not very good, I think he can be replaced easily.

[YDFL Commish]

Originally Posted by HoosierinFL

I'd keep Kelly but Smith is very expensive and just not very good, I think he can be replaced easily.

I agree with this assessment.

[ChoppedWood]

This is basically the Ballard approach. Convince yourself that those already in your keep are inherently better than anything you could get from another roster, simply based on the fact you are familiar with them.

This is the team run-it-back approach, it is a huge driver in why we can't fucking get over the hump- the players are just "good enough" to keep from being a bottom feeder but they aren't nearly to the level it takes to win on an elite NFL level. Fuck that, it is time to start trimming the fat and sending a message that the floor is now higher and if you can't meet that minimum floor expectation, you can't be a Colt.

That said, this is Ballard, his floor for anyone that has worn the blue and white, is absurdly low, so they will both be Colts, and probably starters, next year.

FUCK CHRIS BALLARD!

[Dam8610]

Originally Posted by ChoppedWood

This is basically the Ballard approach. Convince yourself that those already in your keep are inherently better than anything you could get from another roster, simply based on the fact you are familiar with them.

This is the team run-it-back approach, it is a huge driver in why we can't fucking get over the hump- the players are just "good enough" to keep from being a bottom feeder but they aren't nearly to the level it takes to win on an elite NFL level. Fuck that, it is time to start trimming the fat and sending a message that the floor is now higher and if you can't meet that minimum floor expectation, you can't be a Colt.

That said, this is Ballard, his floor for anyone that has worn the blue and white, is absurdly low, so they will both be Colts, and probably starters, next year.

FUCK CHRIS BALLARD!

You always have a criticism, but how about for once you talk about what you would like to see happen as an alternative instead of just incessantly bitching, whining, moaning, and desperately wishing that Chris Ballard will finally come to your bedroom tonight?

[albany ed]

For me, both Kelly and Smith have become part time players, so they are the chief reason depth becomes more important. Keeping Smith is very costly and IMO, not worth it. This money can be used to get some serious depth. As for Kelly, first of all, thank you, you've been a great center for the Colts for years. However, the harsh truth of pro football is that it takes a toll on your body, particularly for interior linemen. If you're going to miss half the season and not be that healthy for the other half, it's time to hang it up. This money can be spent elsewhere and the Colts can have the depth they require.

[ukcolt]

I am not sure what some of you were watching last year. Braden Smith had a knee injury that he was battling through and was still playing fairly decent football, next to the turnstile that was Dalton Tucker. For what it might be worth he had a 66.2 grade with PFF, which ranked him as the 49th best tackle in the league. He had an 83.3 grade in 2023. We don't know what his personal issues are and I sincerely hope that things are not too catastrophic, he is by far our best option at RT if healthy. He is one of the top 5 RT's in the league assuming he is fully healthy. People also need to realise he is only 28 years old, 29 in March, he is in his absolute prime years as a player. Fingers crossed he, or his family are ok. If he returns to the standards of 2023 he is on a fair market price on this contract at $19.75m

The problem as fans, we are not privy to his ongoing issues so don't know how to plan going forward.......but for the love of god that isn't our job either, we are just fans.

[ukcolt]

I do agree though that I think it is time to move on from Ryan Kelly. He had a reasonable season last year, ranking according to PFF as the 17th best center. But in his absence Bortolini stepped in and played to a very similar standard, and was ranked as PFF's 22nd ranked center. Kelly excels in pass protection, whereas Bortolini was a more rounded player, but you would like to think he has far more potential to grow and develop as a player. What we would miss, initially at least is the elite level of tactical nous regards protections. Which might be a significant factor with the perceived inabilities that AR has on reading some of the disguises defenses show presnap.

A starting line of Raimann, Nelson, Bortolini, Fries and Smith could be awesome. Goncalves, Freeland, Glowinski, Tucker and French backing them up is also solid depth.

Monies invested in this lineup would be Raimann $3.5m, Nelson $22.7m, Bortonlini, $1.2m, Fries lets guess $13m, Smith $19.75m. That would be a total of 60.15m for the starters, the backups (French $1m, Goncalves 1.9m, Freeland $1.3m, Glowinski $1.5m, Tucker $1m) would command a further $6.7m, for a grand total of about $67m

For context last year we spent $67.3m

[Dam8610]

Originally Posted by ukcolt

I am not sure what some of you were watching last year. Braden Smith had a knee injury that he was battling through and was still playing fairly decent football, next to the turnstile that was Dalton Tucker. For what it might be worth he had a 66.2 grade with PFF, which ranked him as the 49th best tackle in the league. He had an 83.3 grade in 2023. We don't know what his personal issues are and I sincerely hope that things are not too catastrophic, he is by far our best option at RT if healthy. He is one of the top 5 RT's in the league assuming he is fully healthy. People also need to realise he is only 28 years old, 29 in March, he is in his absolute prime years as a player. Fingers crossed he, or his family are ok. If he returns to the standards of 2023 he is on a fair market price on this contract at $19.75m

The problem as fans, we are not privy to his ongoing issues so don't know how to plan going forward.......but for the love of god that isn't our job either, we are just fans.

I'm not a huge fan of PFF grades, but just by watching, Matt Goncalves was not a noticeable dropoff from Braden Smith, so why pay Smith $20 mil when Goncalves can provide similar play for 3rd round rookie money? I'll put it this way: I'd rather have Jevon Holland and Goncalves starting at RT than Braden Smith.

[IndyNorm]

Originally Posted by albany ed

For me, both Kelly and Smith have become part time players, so they are the chief reason depth becomes more important. .

To me this is the biggest factor in letting them go as well. Even if both Kelly and Smith were playing at the level they were earlier in their careers you can't pay them like we have been if they're only gong to be available ~60% of the time.

It borders on insanity to let Kelly walk and at the same time lose Braden Smith to either retirement or release.

Ballard did that once and we had our worst season since 2017. Who wants to live through that again.

If Smith retires, then resign Kelly. If Smith agrees to stay and restructure, then you consider letting Kelly walk.

The big difference between now and then is that Goncalves and Bortolini are far better than Pryor and an out of position Pinter.

I agree that we have many holes to fill, which is why I would part ways with Smith. It's better to get out on a player a year early than a year late, and having Goncalves means we have a starting caliber RT at a fraction of the price, and the money saved can be reallocated to address some of those roster needs. Backup OT is also a much cheaper position to fill than starting RT. I'd be willing to draft a rookie and let he and Freeland battle it out for the swing tackle spot if it meant Jevon Holland and D.J. Reed/Charvarius Ward were shoring up the secondary.

Definitely agree with this. Of course this assumes that Ballard will take the additional salary cap space we'll get from releasing Smith and put it to good use rather than stick it in his next year(s) lock box. I know he said he is going to be more active in FA at his year end presser, but we've heard similar promises in the past where in the end he didn't do a single thing (improving the secondary in his post '23 season presser for example).

[ChoppedWood]

Originally Posted by IndyNorm

To me this is the biggest factor in letting them go as well. Even if both Kelly and Smith were playing at the level they were earlier in their careers you can't pay them like we have been if they're only gong to be available ~60% of the time.



The big difference between now and then is that Goncalves and Bortolini are far better than Pryor and an out of position Pinter.



Definitely agree with this. Of course this assumes that Ballard will take the additional salary cap space we'll get from releasing Smith and put it to good use rather than stick it in his next year(s) lock box. I know he said he is going to be more active in FA at his year end presser, but we've heard similar promises in the past where in the end he didn't do a single thing (improving the secondary in his post '23 season presser for example).

Dammy---- in response to your continued pestering of me to be laptop GM see the great breakdown above from NORM^^^^^^

And for the record, I have in the past provided specific example of what I would do in terms of personnel. You of course couldn't stand the idea (principally because it involved getting rid of a current Colts player [I used to wonder if you were secretly Pags posting, but perhaps you are really Chris Ballard since you seem to think EXACTLY like him and seem really content with sucking forever just because you like your guys]. So shut your trap about not backing up my bitching with "solutions".

As for Kelly. I heard some talk on the radio that Kelly is expecting a 2 year deal for $19M which would make him the 7th highest paid center in the league. Nope, nope, nope. $8.5 for a guy that is basically a part time player when we have what appears to be a good replacement already on the roster and at a steep discount- hell no! Tell him, 1 year deal $6M, games played incentive kicker that can push it to $8M max if he starts all 17, or else take a hike. He would of course walk; Insert Bortolini and go get some decent backup either late in the draft or off someone else's roster (get a vet at the position FBF!).

Smith- due $17M this year, $17 fucking million dollars; that would rank him 10th in RT's. There isn't a fucking way in hell you keep him at that rate. Sorry, probably has had some tragic thing happen in his family, that sucks, doesn't change the economics. There are approximately 30 fucking RT's up in FA this year. About 10 of them making $5M or less. Just go get one of those guys, give them a few extra bucks, draft a mid round RT, and say good-bye to Smith; the time has come for that from both a productivity and money standpoint.

Are you fucking happy now? Or, should I include what type of conditioning program I want them doing, outline my expectations for their sleep patterns, provide feedback on whether they should stay in Indy in the offseason or work with a trainer in Birmingham? You do realize, we're fans here, that none of us actually get paid by the NFL in any way right? What we type here in terms of solutions has effectively ZERO fucking impact on the realities of NFL organizations? Fans rant and rage, because they are FANS, not GM's, not coaches, not NFL players---- You get that correct?