Colts Release Leonard

[apballin]

Originally Posted by Dam8610

You don't think he's lost value in the last eight months?

It’s not about value with the Colts… it’s simple really…. They want guys that wanna be here and wanna play for the shoe

Leonard sealed his fate by going to the media and complaining about coaching and playing time

And I’m sure more was said in that meeting with Bradley when he told him he’d be inactive. That was probably the final straw

[Dam8610]

Originally Posted by Oldcolt

AR will have a better career than that POS Stroud.

My heart is with you, but my head says a glass cannon only fires once and the best ability is availability.

Originally Posted by apballin

It’s not about value with the Colts… it’s simple really…. They want guys that wanna be here and wanna play for the shoe

Leonard sealed his fate by going to the media and complaining about coaching and playing time

And I’m sure more was said in that meeting with Bradley when he told him he’d be inactive. That was probably the final straw

What does this have to do with my post? Not trying to be a smartass, I just honestly don't know how to respond to this in a way that furthers the discussion. The Colts are building a good culture, great. They should. What does that have to do with Leonard's value decreasing (or not) between the end of last season and now?

[Colts And Orioles]

Originally Posted by Colts And Orioles

o


First of all, when a player comes back from injury, one of the ways in which they can recover their form is by getting a lot of reps ...... and Leonard was not getting them. And that is why I had no problem with him asking for more playing time.

If he catches on with another team either this year or next year, and he gets the playing time that he feels that he needs to become more effective, we may see him resurrect his career.


If you want to assume that he's a malcontent because he made it known that he thought that he wasn't getting enough playing time, fine ...... I don't buy that generic philosophy.

o

o


A side note in regard to "attitude", and "leadership" ......

Playing well almost always overshadows all of that criteria/philosophy. I don't think that there was a single ColtFreaks poster that would refer to Jonathan Taylor as a "leader" and/or that he had a "good attitude", and/or that he was "a good presence in the locker room" when he was holding out at the beginning of the season, and making it clear that he thought that he deserved more money than what the Colts were offering ...... but when Taylor was rushing for 7.9 yards-per-carry against the Saints, catching 5 passes in the 2 games against the Jaguars and the Panthers, and scoring the only TD of the game against the Patriots, I would fathom to guess that there were very few Colts fans that were thinking, "Man, he's an excellent player, but I just wish that he had a better attitude and was more of a leader in the locker room. I wish that he had more loyalty to the Shoe."

o

[apballin]

Originally Posted by Dam8610

My heart is with you, but my head says a glass cannon only fires once and the best ability is availability.



What does this have to do with my post? Not trying to be a smartass, I just honestly don't know how to respond to this in a way that furthers the discussion. The Colts are building a good culture, great. They should. What does that have to do with Leonard's value decreasing (or not) between the end of last season and now?

They weren’t trading him that was my point, he forced his way out.

As far as value they should’ve let him walk when he was a free agent because after the back injury he’s played like shit

[Chromeburn]

Originally Posted by Dam8610

You don't think he's lost value in the last eight months?

What trade value do you think he had? A sixth?

[Oldcolt]

We will have to see how much glass AR is made of. Injuries happen. When they happen early in a career the pall of 'is this a view of the future' runs over it. Most of the time that is not the case. You liked Stroud better than AR but if my memory serves me I don't remember you ever, not even once, say that it was because AR was injury prone. To me AR wasn't injury prone then nor is he now. He has been unlucky and still has the mental and physical tools that seem perfect for a modern NFL QB. One last advantage AR has, and it is huge, is Steichen. I'll couch this in nobody really knows what will happen as we go forward. Fun to speculate though.

[Hoopsdoc]

Originally Posted by Dam8610

Also, random aside in part thanks to thread necromancer C & O, but I'm starting to think Ballard's conservatism will be his downfall. This is a perfect example. Last offseason, Shaq Leonard likely had some trade value, especially with the Bears. But in a situation that required Ballard to swing for the fences and creatively use his assets, he sat on his hands and let other teams decide his fate. If you think Jonathan Taylor wouldn't have had as much or more value than D.J. Moore, you're crazy. The Colts likely could've gotten the #1 pick without giving up 2 1st round picks by trading Leonard and Taylor, and could've had the QB that looks like he's going to haunt the AFC South for the next decade. The Colts then could've resigned Okereke for the same contract he got with the Giants, and the Colts could be back on top of the AFC South for the next decade. Now, the Colts got nothing for Leonard, and Taylor is great, but I'd trade him and a lot more for Stroud right now.

You don’t build culture by trading a four time all pro because you suspect he might not live up to his contract.

Thats not how any of this works.

These guys are human beings. They’re not just assets.

[IndyNorm]

Originally Posted by Dam8610

Also, random aside in part thanks to thread necromancer C & O, but I'm starting to think Ballard's conservatism will be his downfall. This is a perfect example. Last offseason, Shaq Leonard likely had some trade value, especially with the Bears. But in a situation that required Ballard to swing for the fences and creatively use his assets, he sat on his hands and let other teams decide his fate. If you think Jonathan Taylor wouldn't have had as much or more value than D.J. Moore, you're crazy. The Colts likely could've gotten the #1 pick without giving up 2 1st round picks by trading Leonard and Taylor, and could've had the QB that looks like he's going to haunt the AFC South for the next decade. The Colts then could've resigned Okereke for the same contract he got with the Giants, and the Colts could be back on top of the AFC South for the next decade. Now, the Colts got nothing for Leonard, and Taylor is great, but I'd trade him and a lot more for Stroud right now.

Or better yet we should have traded our 1st and Marlin Mack in '21 to jump ahead of the Cheats for Mac Jones.

[Dam8610]

Originally Posted by Chromeburn

What trade value do you think he had? A sixth?

In the right situation, I could see him having carried equivalent weight to a late 2 or early 3 last offseason. Not that he would've gotten a pick like that in a trade, more like how DJ Moore was used as a substitute for a 1st round pick by the Panthers.

Originally Posted by Oldcolt

We will have to see how much glass AR is made of. Injuries happen. When they happen early in a career the pall of 'is this a view of the future' runs over it. Most of the time that is not the case. You liked Stroud better than AR but if my memory serves me I don't remember you ever, not even once, say that it was because AR was injury prone. To me AR wasn't injury prone then nor is he now. He has been unlucky and still has the mental and physical tools that seem perfect for a modern NFL QB. One last advantage AR has, and it is huge, is Steichen. I'll couch this in nobody really knows what will happen as we go forward. Fun to speculate though.

He did have an injury history, and not a particularly light one, either. He has a Netflix documentary where he suffers the exact same injury that ended his season this year in high school, and he had a pretty bad knee injury at Florida in 2021. One of the areas that can severely impact a projection of a player is injury history, and it's nearly impossible to know if you're not in one of the 32 war rooms. All the tape in the world won't give you anything on a player's medicals, and that is a huge part of a player evaluation.

Originally Posted by Hoopsdoc

You don’t build culture by trading a four time all pro because you suspect he might not live up to his contract.

Thats not how any of this works.

These guys are human beings. They’re not just assets.

Tell that to Howie Roseman. He'd offload a player like that in exactly the way I suggested so fast it would make your head spin. In fact, you don't have to hypothetically consider it, he did it with Carson Wentz.

Originally Posted by IndyNorm

Or better yet we should have traded our 1st and Marlin Mack in '21 to jump ahead of the Cheats for Mac Jones.

I'd prefer to trade up for Stroud in a scenario of hypothetical druthers, but Mac Jones is a great example of what a bad set of circumstances within a franchise can do to a good QB prospect, especially if they are more circumstance dependent. Couldn't have happened to a better franchise, but I feel bad for the kid.

[Oldcolt]

Yes I understand that this shoulder has been injured before. An injured AC joint weakens that joint and makes that joint more prone to injury. It has been repaired and should not be an issue going forward, one of the reasons surgery was the best options. It means nothing else. It certainly doesn't mean he is injury prone.