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  #21  
Old 02-04-2022, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Racehorse View Post



By the way, here is my rankings of all-time NBA players:

1. Earvin "Magic" Johnson (the only player I have ever seen dominate a game from any of the five positions)
2. Jordan
3. Bird
4. Wilt
5. Kareem
6. Russell
7. Kobe
8. Hakeem
9. Shaq
10. Maybe Lebron?


o


In my rat's ass of an opinion, I would put Bird above Jordan, and here's why.


Larry Bird almost single-handedly took the 2nd-worst team in the NBA (the 1978-79 Boston Celtics) and led them to the best record in the NBA (61-21) in his rookie season in 1979-80. After the Celtics drafted Kevin McHale and traded for Robert Parish, the Celtics won the NBA Championship in only Bird's second season in the league. The Celtics continued to be a juggernaut throughout Bird's prime, consistently winning 60-or-more games on a regular basis, wracking up a total of 3 NBA Championships, 5 NBA Finals appearances, and 8 trips to the Eastern Conference Finals ...... and when Bird missed almost the entire 1988-89 season, the Celtics went from being a perennial juggernaut to being just an average team with a record of 42-40. The next season when Bird came back, they went back to being a dominant team again with a 52-30 overall record ...... even though Bird was slightly past his prime at this point, it was very clear that as Bird went, so went the Celtics. Without Bird, the team, which included Hall-of-Famers Robert Parrish, Kevin McHale, and Dennis Johnson, barely broke the .500 mark. When Bird returned (albeit slightly past his prime), they resumed to their typical 50-plus win season/championship contender status.


When Jordan joined the Bulls, they were a similarly bad team as were the Celtics prior to Bird joining then ...... but unlike Bird, who immediately led them to having the best record in the NBA in his rookie season, Jordan's Bulls only improved to being an average team with a record slightly below .500 (38-44.) That pattern repeated itself for 2 additional seasons in 1985-86 and 1986-87 (40-42.) While Jordan missed the majority of his 2nd season with a broken foot, they were still the same average team that finished slightly-below .500 in his 3rd season in 1986-87. Finally, in Jordan's 4th season, they established themselves as a solid, winning team that went 50-32 overall and won a playoff series ...... the first time in Jordan's career in which his team did so. That was also the season in which they drafted Scottie Pippen.

Over the next 2 seasons the Bulls continued to improve in both the regular season and the post-season, but were stopped by the Detroit Pistons each time in the Eastern Conference Finals. In Jordan's 7th season, his time finally won it all, and in the process Jordan established himself as the best overall player in the NBA as well as one of the greatest players ever.

When Jordan first retired, the Bulls went 55-27 without him ...... an incredible feat, considering the fact that they had just lost the best player in the league. They also won a playoff series (something Jordan never did until Scottie Pippen and company joined him in his 4th season in the league.) Not only that, but they were robbed of winning another playoff series in the now infamous "Hugh Hollins" classic. If Hollins had not made than phantom foul call at the end of Game 5 of that playoff series, the Bulls would have advanced AT LEAST to the Eastern Conference Finals and maybe even the NBA Finals ...... it is one of the "great ifs" in NBA history as to whether or not Scottie Pippen, Toni Kukoc, Horace Grant, and Phil Jackson might have actually won a championship without Jordan if not for Hollins' call.


******************************


On the side of the argument FOR Jordan ......



1) l He was actually slightly UNDERRATED defensively ..... he won Defensive Player of the Year in his 4th season in the league (1987-88), and his incredible offensive numbers overshadowed his elite defensive skills. He led the league in steals 3 times, including the season in which he won that Defensive Player of the Year award.

2) l He led the league in scoring 10 times, ESSENTIALLY 10 CONSECUTIVE TIMES, considering that he missed the entire 1993-94 season and almost the entire 1994-95 season with his first retirement.

3) l He oversaw 2 mini-dynasties with the Bulls.

4) l He won 5 MVP awards, finished 2nd 3 additional times, and finished 3rd 2 more times (that's 5 Golds, and 3 Silvers, and 2 Bronzes.)

5) l He was the ultimate competitor, leading the league in minutes played twice, and willing his team to victory in the pivotal 5th game of the 1997 NBA Finals when his body was ravaged with the flu ...... Scottie Pippen continually helping Jordan off of the court throughout the game was reminiscent of when a dehydrated Kellen Winslow was continually helped off of the field by his teammates in a double-overtime 1981 playoff win in hot, humid Miami.

6) l When he was slightly past his prime, he made an otherwise awful Washington Bullets team respectable ...... they went 37-45 in 2 consecutive seasons before Jordan finally called it quits for good in April of 2003.

o
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Last edited by Colts And Orioles; 02-04-2022 at 10:01 PM.
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  #22  
Old 02-04-2022, 06:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Colts And Orioles View Post
o


In my rat's ass of an opinion, I would put Bird above Jordan, and here's why.


Larry Bird almost single-handedly took the 2nd-worst team in the NBA (the 1978-79 Boston Celtics) and led them to the best record in the NBA (61-21) in his rookie season in 1979-80. After the Celtics drafted Kevin McHale and traded for Robert Parish, the Celtics won the NBA Championship in only Bird's second season in the league. The Celtics continued to be a juggernaut throughout Bird's prime, consistently winning 60-or-more games on a regular basis, wracking up a total of 3 NBA Championships, 5 NBA Finals appearances, and 8 trips to the Eastern Conference Finals ...... and when Bird missed almost the entire 1988-89 season, the Celtics went from being a perennial juggernaut to being just an average team with a record of 42-40. The next season when Bird came back, they went back to being a dominant team again with a 52-30 overall record ...... even though Bird was slightly past his prime at this point, it was very clear that as Bird went, so went the Celtics. Without Bird, the team, which included Hall-of-Famers Robert Parrish, Kevin McHale, and Dennis Johnson, barely broke the .500 mark. When Bird returned (albeit slightly past his prime), they resumed to their typical 50-plus win season/championship contender status.


When Jordan joined the Bulls, they were a similarly bad team as were the Celtics prior to Bird joining then ...... but unlike Bird, who immediately led them to having the best record in the NBA in his rookie season, Jordan's Bulls only improved to being an average team with a record slightly below .500 (38-44.) That pattern repeated itself for 2 additional seasons in 1985-86 and 1986-87 (40-42.) While Jordan missed the majority of his 2nd season with a broken foot, they were still the same average team that finished slightly-below .500 in his 3rd season in 1986-87. Finally, in Jordan's 4th season, they established themselves as a solid, winning team that went 50-32 overall and won a playoff series ...... the first time in Jordan's career in which his team did so. That was also the season in which they drafted Scottie Pippen.

Over the next 2 seasons the Bulls continued to improve in both the regular season and the post-season, but were stopped by the Detroit Pistons each time in the Eastern Conference Finals. In Jordan's 7th season, his time finally won it all, and in the process Jordan established himself as the best overall player in the NBA as well as one of the greatest eplayers ver.

When Jordan first retired, the Bulls went 55-27 without him ...... an incredible feat, considering the fact that they had just lost the best player in the league. They also won a playoff series (something Jordan never did until Scottie Pippen and company joined him in his 4th season in the league.) Not only that, but they were robbed of winning another playoff series in the now infamous "Hugh Hollins" classic. If Hollins had not made than phantom foul call at the end of Game 5 of that playoff series, the Bulls would have advanced AT LEAST to the Eastern Conference Finals and maybe even the NBA Finals ...... it is one of the "great ifs" in NBA history as to whether or not Scottie Pippen, Toni Kukoc, Horace Grant, and Phil Jackson might have actually won a championship without Jordan if not for Hollins' call.


******************************


On the side of the argument FOR Jordan ......



1) l He was actually slightly UNDERRATED defensively ..... he won Defensive Player of the Year in his 4th season in the league (1987-88), and his incredible offensive numbers overshadowed his elite defensive skills. He led the league in steals 3 times, including the season in which he won that Defensive Player of the Year award.

2) l He led the league in scoring 10 times, ESSENTIALLY 10 CONSECUTIVE TIMES, considering that he missed the entire 1993-94 season and almost the entire 1994-95 season with his first retirement.

3) l He oversaw 2 mini-dynasties with the Bulls.

4) l He won 5 MVP awards, finished 2nd 3 additional times, and finished 3rd 2 more times (that's 5 Golds, and 3 Silvers, and 2 Bronzes.)

5) l He was the ultimate competitor, leading the league in minutes played twice, and willing his team to victory in the pivotal 5th game of the 1997 NBA Finals when his body was ravaged with the flu ...... Scottie Pippen continually helping Jordan off of the court throughout the game was reminiscent of when a dehydrated Kellen Winslow was continually helped off of the field by his teammates in a double-overtime 1981 playoff win in hot, humid Miami.

6) l When he was slightly past his prime, he made an otherwise awful Washington Bullets team respectable ...... they went 37-45 in 2 consecutive seasons before Jordan finally called it quits for good in April of 2003.

o
I can agree. However, Bird entered the year older than Jordan was when he entered. Bird could be considered the GOAT by many. I actually thing the top three are so close that it doesn't matter to me the order.
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  #23  
Old 02-23-2022, 06:17 PM
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And the sellout award of the year goes to…
https://thespun.com/nfl/afc-east/new...mhON0hlSlJQelM.
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Old 02-23-2022, 08:36 PM
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And the sellout award of the year goes to…
https://thespun.com/nfl/afc-east/new...mhON0hlSlJQelM.
Dude is a total douche
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