Official Ravens suck Game day thread

[Chromeburn]

Originally Posted by Hoopsdoc

I was curious so I went and looked up Ballards second round picks.

2017-Quincy Wilson: grade F.
2018-Shaq Leonard A+ Braden Smith A Kemoko Turay F Tyquan Lewis C
2019-Rock Ya Sin F Ben Banogu F- Paris Campbell F
2020- Michael Pittman Jr A+ Jonathon Taylor A+
2021- Dayo Odeyingbo C
2022- Alec Pierce A+
2023- Juju Brents F
2024- AD Mitchell F
2025- JT Tuimoloau incomplete but not looking good.
2026- CJ Allen. Incomplete.

So that’s four home runs, one excellent pick, two decent picks, two unknowns, and seven busts.

I’m not sure what the average is in the 2nd round but that doesn’t strike me as very good.

He gambles a lot on traits in the second round. Why it’s home runs or strike outs. Now compare it with the rest of the league. .500 is above average for drafting. And usually drafts are judged if the player is still in the league contributing. Yeah it sucks if he doesn’t stay with your team, but they have a cap for a reason.

Usually you judge by home run, starter, contributor/backup, bust

Busts are usually half the draft or more. Home runs are super rare.

[Oldcolt]

I guess my issue isn't exactly that he misses so many second rounders, it is that he misses on so many defensive lineman and corners in the second round. On our roster if he had hit on even a few of them we have a totally different defense. I like Ballard as a human being but he sucks at evaluating players at incredibly important positions

[rm1369]

Originally Posted by Chromeburn

I have a simple question for you, did you play any football?

Yes, but not to a level that will satisfy you. And as I’ve already stated, the questions being asked were by media, not me, so other people had concerns or at least questions about the methods. Ballard has had plenty of questions locally and nationally about the exact things I’ve brought up. I’m not pretending to have some deep insight, I had a strong belief that so far has been pretty damn accurate. I really don’t care if you agree. Hell, in some of Ballard’s quote HE agrees that he failed in areas I pointed out.

I really don’t care if you agree with WHY I think Ballard has failed. For all my supposed ignorance I do know how to read a won / loss record. I’ve watched every game of his tenure. I’ve seen how his team has performed. If you think he’s a great GM, so be it. I just hope he takes his greatness to another team. Soon. It hasn’t worked here. I know there are different team building styles even if you think there aren’t. There are different opinions on leadership and different opinions on how to develop a young QB (I agree Irsay forced the AR start).

You seem to think because I have an opinion on my favorite team, I think I’m an expert and qualified to run a team myself. It’s a ridiculous notion on your part. This is exactly what fans do. My disregarding Polians opinion is because Ballard is 9 years in, we are well past the point that I need to defer to Polian as to how Ballard will perform. Polian is a HOFer but he’s also been wrong. That’s not a knock, it’s fact. It’s pretty clear to a lot of people this is one of those times. I hope Ballard is successful in his next job. And I agree he will get another. But you can also tell from his comments that he has learned and changed some from this process. Or at least he claims he has.

The ironic thing is that you almost never see me discussing or evaluating players pre draft. The reason is because I don’t study tape and I don’t research of follow that level of player evaluation. However I do have decades of experience in leadership and team building, so I have a higher degree of opinion on that. And I do find NFL and NBA team building fascinating and have researched the assembly of different high level teams. That has colored my opinion. Not to a PHd level or anything but it is something I find fascinating. Which is why I bristle every time one of Ballard’s supporters pretends there was no other viable way to build a team other than how he has done it. I know damn well that’s not true.

There are plenty of Ballard “failures” that I don’t say anything about. Every GM is going to have a good amount of individual failures. Hell, I have a lot of experience in hiring people and know how difficult it is. I know it’s even more difficult at that level. The ones I hit Ballard on are the ones I see as systemic to his philosophy. That typically means things he has said and then we’ve seen his actions back it up. Not individual player evaluations but the repeating larger philosophy that I’ve never agreed with and believe has undermined the things I believe Ballard does do well. And I point out that I’ve been saying it for years because every Ballard supporter has done exactly what you are trying to do, but their usual tactic has been to accuse me of hindsight. Now even though I have accurately stated exactly where the team would be (mediocre, rarely bottom of the league) I’m just ignorant. So be it. I’ve already given your arrogant ass much more time than I should.

As I said, enjoy the season. I have nothing else to say to you about it.

[Chromeburn]

Originally Posted by rm1369

Yes, but not to a level that will satisfy you. And as I’ve already stated, the questions being asked were by media, not me, so other people had concerns or at least questions about the methods. Ballard has had plenty of questions locally and nationally about the exact things I’ve brought up. I’m not pretending to have some deep insight, I had a strong belief that so far has been pretty damn accurate. I really don’t care if you agree. Hell, in some of Ballard’s quote HE agrees that he failed in areas I pointed out.

I really don’t care if you agree with WHY I think Ballard has failed. For all my supposed ignorance I do know how to read a won / loss record. I’ve watched every game of his tenure. I’ve seen how his team has performed. If you think he’s a great GM, so be it. I just hope he takes his greatness to another team. Soon. It hasn’t worked here. I know there are different team building styles even if you think there aren’t. There are different opinions on leadership and different opinions on how to develop a young QB (I agree Irsay forced the AR start).

You seem to think because I have an opinion on my favorite team, I think I’m an expert and qualified to run a team myself. It’s a ridiculous notion on your part. This is exactly what fans do. My disregarding Polians opinion is because Ballard is 9 years in, we are well past the point that I need to defer to Polian as to how Ballard will perform. Polian is a HOFer but he’s also been wrong. That’s not a knock, it’s fact. It’s pretty clear to a lot of people this is one of those times. I hope Ballard is successful in his next job. And I agree he will get another. But you can also tell from his comments that he has learned and changed some from this process. Or at least he claims he has.

The ironic thing is that you almost never see me discussing or evaluating players pre draft. The reason is because I don’t study tape and I don’t research of follow that level of player evaluation. However I do have decades of experience in leadership and team building, so I have a higher degree of opinion on that. And I do find NFL and NBA team building fascinating and have researched the assembly of different high level teams. That has colored my opinion. Not to a PHd level or anything but it is something I find fascinating. Which is why I bristle every time one of Ballard’s supporters pretends there was no other viable way to build a team other than how he has done it. I know damn well that’s not true.

There are plenty of Ballard “failures” that I don’t say anything about. Every GM is going to have plenty of individual failures. Hell, I have plenty of experience in hiring people and know how difficult it is. I’m know it’s even more difficult at that level. The ones I hit Ballard on are the ones I see as systemic to his philosophy. Not individual player evaluations but the repeating larger philosophy that I’ve never agreed with and believe has undermined the things I believe Ballard does do well. And I point out that I’ve been saying it for years because every Ballard supporter has done exactly what you are trying to do, but their usual tactic has been to accuse me of hindsight. Now even though I have accurately stated exactly where the team would be (mediocre, rarely bottom of the league) I’m just ignorant. So be it. I’ve already given your arrogant ass much more time than I should.

As I said, enjoy the season. I have nothing else to say to you about it.

So how often did a player you were competing with for a position take you under his wing and teach you things? It's rare; people don't want to help their replacements. Some vets are very frank about it, like Joe Flacco. What often happens is the opposite: plenty of stories of young players being sabotaged by vets. It happens more than you think.

Your corporate environment is not really comparable unless you worked in a boiler room. Sure, some concepts are universal, but the environments and employee makeup are very different, and making an employee teach a replacement is a crappy thing to expect in any field. You are talking about a bunch of type A, perhaps doped up, athletes around the same age competing for the same jobs. And before you start up yeah, I have an MBA, and I've studied team building. Read the prerequisite sports books etc.

As for the Hankins stuff, you are reading way too much into it. Me not remembering Ballard signing him is a memory thing, not a football thing. Hankins being let go is because he didn't fit Eberflus' defense, not because Ballard dislikes veterans. It's simple things like this that make me think you don't know what you are talking about. Ballard values vet leadership; he just doesn't think it's fair to expect them to coach their replacements, and he is right. The coach should be the teacher and the guy the player trusts to have his best interests. When I refer to his philosophy, I'm talking about the draft strategy, positional emphasis and design of the team, where to spend money and why.

When you are talking team building and accountability, that is more in the coaches' department. That is why I get sick of the posts, because people don't know how football teams work, division of responsibilities. People just blame one guy because people don't like complicated. However, that isn't how NFL teams work. What does maga say, "orange man bad", or the other side would say, "thanks Obama," no matter what happens. That's what I think I see out of the fanbase and it's exhausting. As I said, there is plenty to hold him accountable for. No GM is perfect, you just hope he is right more than he is wrong. But you pay them to make decisions.

No, I think you are dismissive of other people's opinions bc it doesn't fit your confirmation bias. I think it's an ego thing. I know enough about football to know I don't know a shit ton and I played in college and coach my kid's teams.