[Dam8610]

Originally Posted by IndyNorm

No doubt, Stroud looks like the real deal. But again, you can't determine if Ballard made the right move or not until a couple years down the road.

I can determine that he did not live up to his word when he said that if a franchise QB was available, he would move heaven and earth to get him. The formerly available franchise QB is now a Texan because Ballard did not move heaven and earth (trade to 1) to get him.

Originally Posted by IndyNorm

Just be a man instead of a little cunt and admit that you were wrong. It's not that hard.


Just be a man instead of a little cunt and admit that you were wrong. It's not that hard.



Sometimes the truth hurts.

So you don't care for nuance at all? I already said everyone was wrong about the 2021 QB class. In some cases, those QBs came in with fatal flaws, in some cases the team destroyed the development of the QB, all 5 of them appear to be busts now. I do wish I had made more noise about Brock Purdy at the time, he impressed me when I was watching Breece Hall and Charlie Kolar film.

Originally Posted by IndyNorm

You bring him up all of the time when he's not mentioned or relevant to a post. So how is he not living rent free in your head?

Because the rest of the world, no less than half of this board included, was ready to anoint him the next Peyton Manning when he came into the league. I correctly predicted that he would never be that, or even close, and seemingly was on an island by myself with that opinion (I think maybe Chris Simms was the only draft media person that didn't have Lawrence as QB1 and Player 1 that year). The only space Trevor Lawrence occupies in my head is as the prime example of "QBs who can't read a defense".

Originally Posted by IndyNorm

If anyone said they didn't want Young drafted by the Colts then they didn't have him rated higher than Stroud. Just as the poll C&O posted shows.

Bullshit. Most people said things like "I don't really have a preference between the 4 QBs, I'll just trust whatever the Colts FO does." That's fine, but you don't get to come back 8 months later claiming a strong opinion on any of them then. Most people who actually ranked the QBs had Young ahead of Stroud. All that poll, entitled "Who do you want at 4?" shows is that most people didn't think any of the QBs were worth trading up for, which was the prevailing sentiment at the time, and most people didn't think Stroud would get to 4, which makes sense because unless Jack Easterby was still running the Texans there's no way he should've gotten past 2 (and the Panthers are kind of stupid for not taking him at 1). It shows that most people thought Richardson was better than Levis, which you didn't have to squint too hard to see. Clearly one of those QBs was worth trading up for.

Originally Posted by IndyNorm

Maybe. Sounds like you're already prepping Young up for Jones/Wilson type of excuses.

I really don't feel it's fair to be held accountable for a dysfunctional organization fucking up a QB, because it wasn't my decisions that fucked up the QB. I couldn't control what the Cheats did to Jones (though if I could I'd've probably traded him because fuck the Cheats), I couldn't control what the Jets did to Wilson, and I can't control what the Panthers do to Young. Sometimes shitty franchises ruin good players.

Originally Posted by IndyNorm

We'll just have to see how it plays out. One thing's for sure though: you bitching non-stop about Ballard not trading up for Stroud isn't going to make a bit of difference other than to continue to annoy everyone else on here.

The discussion will stop if you stop replying. I enjoy discussion, especially on topics I feel strongly about.

Originally Posted by IndyNorm

Not only is he likely to be gone, but there's no way Ballard would draft him at 15 b/c that would mean that he's giving up on AR. So even suggesting that we draft Daniels is stupid.

If Richardson doesn't pan out, I won't be the only Colts fan that will count all the franchise QBs Ballard missed believing in him.

Originally Posted by IndyNorm

That's a step in the right direction, but there are plenty of other times where you were wrong and won't admit it like w/ Wilson and Jones. You also claimed before the season started that Daniel Jones was a good QB and predicted that he'd have a good year. You going to admit you were wrong there or come up with some BS excuse as to why you're not?

I did that to show that I actually do reconsider my positions and change them when the evidence shows I should. Once again, with Wilson and Jones, I firmly believe their organizations did several disservices to their development, so while they likely won't be good NFL QBs now, no one will ever know what would've happened if they went to situations better suited to their success. I'll certainly say that the Jets shouldn't have drafted Wilson and the Cheats shouldn't have drafted Jones based on what they did to them, but, as an example, if either had gone to a situation like Jordan Love's, I think either of them would've turned out better than Jordan Love.

As for Daniel Jones, I vaguely remember a discussion where I said he could be a top 15 QB this year. I don't think that was as outlandish of a claim as you make it out to be. Obviously he wasn't because he got hurt, but based on his 2022, "league average starter" was not an outlandish claim for Daniel Jones.

Originally Posted by IndyNorm

Agree that most people were probably taking draft position into consideration, but the poll is still objective evidence against your claim that you were the only one who had Stroud rated higher than Young. And BTW I voted for Stroud in that poll too.

The poll is clearly worded in such a way that "at 4" is a consideration in the vote. That makes it objective evidence that the votes reflect who people want "at 4", which allows people to make assumptions of which 3 players will be picked by that point. Most people would've assumed Stroud and Young to be gone at that point, and wouldn't have voted for them for that reason. It seems you may be the only one on the board who believed Stroud would be available at 4, because both C & O and I have said we did not take "at 4" into consideration and voted for who we wanted.

Originally Posted by ChaosTheory

Just regarding the pre-draft QB's... I remember this board being one of the few places not on the Bryce Young train. We had more guys calling for Will Levis than Bryce Young. AR had the most interest.

I know there were guys here on board with Stroud over the rest. I want to say myself, Commish, rm, Norm (?) were a few.

I was coming from a different place than Dam, though. I wasn't super sold on any of them. I just thought Stroud had the best passing skills. He had a great rookie year, but I'm still not ready to anoint him. Especially because AR impressed in limited action and I'm excited for him to take the cuffs our roster which is better than what Stroud has.

I think you would agree that there is a difference in these two positions:

1) Stroud is the best of the 4 QBs but it is a very close group.

2) Stroud is hands down, far and away the best QB in this class because he's the most pro ready and carries the least risk factors.

The first position (the one you professed in your post) would lead you to stand pat and take whoever falls to you at 4.

The second position (my position since January 2023) would cause you to move heaven and earth to get to 1.

Originally Posted by Racehorse

I'm not going to comment on much here, except how you act (harp on) regarding Stroud, and the part about votes and moving heaven and earth.

Yes, I think most of us voted with the idea that it was between Levis and AR. There was no feasible concept where we would get a shot at Stroud or Young. It was known for quite some time that Carolina moved up to get Young. This means we were not going to get a shot at Stroud, because HOU is a division rival. You say we could have moved up like Carolina did, but the asking price was very steep, it seems. Why do that if you have Stroud and Richardson rated about equally, as it seems Ballard did?

About your harping, that is the real issue. I am not asking you to "admit" that Stroud was not as you predicted, because that would be a lie. I am saying that you should give it a rest. we all agree he is doing an amazing job, but we also saw what AR was able to do in our offense, and it was just as electric.

Would you prefer 95% odds of getting the thing you want or 50% odds? That's why I'm frustrated. If you want me to stop talking about it, stop coming back to reply. I enjoy the discussion, but discussion takes more than one party.

Originally Posted by omahacolt

exactly


its fucking insane the amount of ego on that guy. nobody wants to sift through his patting himself on the back to understand his fucking point.

This post, coming from you, is hilarious. No one on this board has a bigger ego than you, and for some reason everyone just lets you get away with it. I have strong opinions, I won't deny that, and I don't back down on them, especially not because "conventional wisdom" says I'm wrong. "Conventional wisdom" leads to a lot of stupid conclusions, and too many football media experts and quite frankly front offices are too heavily influenced by it. So I'm not going to back down from my opinions when I form them just because "conventional wisdom" says to do so. If you want to get me to say I'm wrong, show me evidence.

Originally Posted by Colts And Orioles

o


I voted for Stroud, but I knew that the Colts had no shot to get him ...... I voted for who I wanted, not who I thought would be available by the time that the Colts picked.

Richardson would have been my 2nd choice.

o

Thank you for illustrating my point. Did anyone here besides me want to move up to 1 for Stroud? I doubt it, or if they did, they were very quiet about it. As things stand today, it seems like it would've been the right move.