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Colts And Orioles 08-25-2019 03:43 PM

New Starting QB Brissett: Perhaps a Legacy of His Own
 
o



In 2008, Matt Cassel stepped in and led the New England Patriots to an 11-5 record when starting quarterback when Tom Brady missed the season with an injury.

Those 2008 Patriots were essentially a playoff team, save for the fact that the stacked AFC that season made the Patriots only the 2nd team since the 16-game schedule was inaugurated in 1978 to fail to to qualify for the postseason (the 1985 Broncos also went 11-5 without a playoff berth.)


This article asserts that when Chris Ballard was hired as the Colts' GM almost 3 years ago, he made sure to point out that one player does not make a football team (a direct reference to star quarterback Andrew Luck.) Ballard wanted to build a complete team so that the weight of the franchise wouldn’t be placed entirely on Luck's shoulders, as it did with the way that the Colts' disastrous 2011 season played out when Peyton Manning missed that entire year with an injury.


So as much of a punch to the stomach that Andrew Luck's sudden retirement was to the Colts and their fans, we will all get to see if the 2019 Colts team that Ballard largely put together can somehow replicate the 2008 Patriots, the 1968 Colts (who went 13-1 and made it to the Super Bowl with Earl Morrall replacing Johnny Unitas at QB), or the 1972 Dolphins (who went 14-0 and won the Super Bowl with Earl Morrall filling in for the injured Bob Griese for more than half of the regular season, plus one-and-a-half of their 3 post-season games.)



If nothing else, it will be interesting to see how this all plays out.



Jacoby Brissett is No Andrew Luck, but His 'Story's is Just Starting' for the Colts

(By Mike Wells)

https://www.espn.com/blog/indianapol...ting-for-colts


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DrSpaceman 08-25-2019 03:46 PM

I am completely behind Brissett and hope he works out.

He didn't ask for this situation.

And he has a much better team behind him now than two years, plus a competent coach.

But I still have my doubts about him. Needs to get the ball out quicker for one. I am sure Reich will focus on that.

Oldcolt 08-25-2019 03:56 PM

C&O Been wanting to hear what your take would be. I think we are both old enough to remember when NFL qb's took several years of seasoning on the bench. Brissett has had that. We have money to spend, won't have 1/4 of our cap allocated to one guy and have a front office that knows what they are doing (Luck punked them; they take the high road keep their mouths shut, pay his sorry ass and keep working). Build a dominant defense to go along with a kick ass offensive line. Been a Colts fan for over 50 years. Shit happens.

JAFF 08-25-2019 04:00 PM

Brissett has a tough job. He's got to accept that punting the ball is ok early in the game. You try to force something, it usually doesn't end well.

He's got to trust the D. He needs to know that he doesn't need to win the game, but turnovers will lose the game.

It's ok to punt in the first three quarters.

It's ok to check down and get positive yards, not a TD.

It's ok to have 21 other guys to help him win the game.

Hoopsdoc 08-25-2019 05:13 PM

This is the chance Jacoby has been waiting for. It’s even better than going somewhere else and learning a whole new system. He’s been in this one for over a year now.

If he can’t succeed here right now, than he’s not a legitimate starter.

Maniac 08-25-2019 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hoopsdoc (Post 127700)
This is the chance Jacoby has been waiting for. It’s even better than going somewhere else and learning a whole new system. He’s been in this one for over a year now.

If he can’t succeed here right now, than he’s not a legitimate starter.

Except there is a lot of pressure on him now, following behind a great player who walked away from a team with superbowl aspirations. Fans are hurt and mad. If he doesn't come through, fans may not be kind to him.

JAFF 08-25-2019 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maniac (Post 127702)
Except there is a lot of pressure on him now, following behind a great player who walked away from a team with superbowl aspirations. Fans are hurt and mad. If he doesn't come through, fans may not be kind to him.

Pressure is a self inflicted wound.

He needs to go be the best he can be and let the other 21 guys hold up their end of the deal

YDFL Commish 08-25-2019 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAFF (Post 127663)
Brissett has a tough job. He's got to accept that punting the ball is ok early in the game. You try to force something, it usually doesn't end well.

He's got to trust the D. He needs to know that he doesn't need to win the game, but turnovers will lose the game.

It's ok to punt in the first three quarters.

It's ok to check down and get positive yards, not a TD.

It's ok to have 21 other guys to help him win the game.

Brissett just needs to play his game. I don't wanna hamstring him in any way. He has proven in 2017 that he knows how to protect the ball. Now he's gotta make the plays that are there to be made and get the ball out sooner to avoid sacks.

So, NO!, I don't want him to be a game manager...and I'm pretty sure Reich doesn't either. That is the Pagano approach to offense, and it's a losing formula...because the opponent catches on to that shit real quick.

JAFF 08-25-2019 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YDFL Commish (Post 127718)

So, NO!, I don't want him to be a game manager...and I'm pretty sure Reich doesn't either. That is the Pagano approach to offense, and it's a losing formula...because the opponent catches on to that shit real quick.

Tom Brady is one of the best game managers. He doesn't take a risk he doesn't need to and he doesn't make a gamble that's not in his favor.

You don't throw into coverage
You don't let your ego overcome your abilities
You don't force the ball into triple coverage.

Game managers WIN games. Manning was one of them.

ChoppedWood 08-25-2019 07:09 PM

If all the stuff we hear about Jacoby is correct, a great leader of men, a guy who doesn't get rattled, a man who the guys like playing with- if those things hold true, he's got a hell of a team assembled around him to let him play Frank Reich football, and that is a trillion light years away from the scary ass shit we saw being run under Pagono's whatever the hell system we were running then... and the call out on that OL vs this one- 100% down with that! He's got men with some anger and some ass in front of him now.

Reich has absolutely proven he knows how to matriculate the ball down the field with high percentage plays that stack up 1st downs, control the clock, and result in points. If Jacoby can just stay in that routine, I think this team can still be very formidable and I gotta believe there are enough natural leaders on the squad that there isn't going to be any other attitude than "let's go do this".

For this year, this needs to be a team that QN and DL set the tone for and see if over time they can create the space for Brisset to emerge as the unquestioned leader that Luck certainly was. It would be great to see someone like Houston or Sheard sort of emerge as that same type of vet presence that Cory Redding became for his era, a guy that the team gravitated to as man that commanded high energy and commitment and you could tell they all wanted to win for.

Hoopsdoc 08-25-2019 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maniac (Post 127702)
Except there is a lot of pressure on him now, following behind a great player who walked away from a team with superbowl aspirations. Fans are hurt and mad. If he doesn't come through, fans may not be kind to him.

This is a golden opportunity for him. It’s his contract year. Go out and light it up and set yourself up to make MILLIONS. If I were in his shoes and I believed in my heart I’m a legitimate starter, I wouldn’t want it any other way. Pressure be damned.

Maniac 08-25-2019 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hoopsdoc (Post 127749)
This is a golden opportunity for him. It’s his contract year. Go out and light it up and set yourself up to make MILLIONS. If I were in his shoes and I believed in my heart I’m a legitimate starter, I wouldn’t want it any other way. Pressure be damned.

It's a great opportunity, it's just not going to be easy. We're going to find out quickly if he can handle the situation he's been put into. He has a better team around him and a better coach, so let's see what he can do.

YDFL Commish 08-25-2019 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAFF (Post 127722)
Tom Brady is one of the best game managers. He doesn't take a risk he doesn't need to and he doesn't make a gamble that's not in his favor.

You don't throw into coverage
You don't let your ego overcome your abilities
You don't force the ball into triple coverage.

Game managers WIN games. Manning was one of them.

No Manning was not a game manager. Right now you are just being fuckin' stupid.

DrSpaceman 08-25-2019 09:33 PM

Reich is also not one as a coach to take a "game manager" approach
with the offense.

We all saw that last year vs Houston. "We aren't playing for ties". And he didn't apologize or backtrack on it.

You can be aggressive on offense without throwing the ball 30 yards down field vertically every play.

AlwaysSunnyinIndy 08-25-2019 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrSpaceman (Post 127650)
Needs to get the ball out quicker for one. I am sure Reich will focus on that.

Reich and Sirianni were already working on that this preseason. Here was an article on colts.com that had quotes from both Reich and Sirianni from a few weeks ago.

https://www.colts.com/news/frank-rei...-training-camp

This particular quote was from Sirianni:

Quote:

“Really, I think it’s just his ability to process the play, see the defense, know where the ball is supposed to go and throw it on time in rhythm,” Sirianni said of Brissett’s improvement. “I have seen that so many times from him where instead of hitch, hitch, throw – he is hitting his back foot, hitch and throw. So what that does is make our offensive line better because they don’t have to protect as long and it makes our receivers better because they can get that initial separation and then not let the guy catch up. Obviously it makes our third down – everything skyrockets when the quarterback can get the ball on time and I have really seen him skyrocket there as far as his development.”

ChoppedWood 08-25-2019 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlwaysSunnyinIndy (Post 127765)
Reich and Sirianni were already working on that this preseason. Here was an article on colts.com that had quotes from both Reich and Sirianni from a few weeks ago.

https://www.colts.com/news/frank-rei...-training-camp

This particular quote was from Sirianni:

Yeah that's the whole thing with him, spinning that SOB out of there when it is on time. Definitely what has been interesting to watch with Kelly- when he commits, that thing is on a rope going right where he wants it, but he too has scared me a few times chopping his feet and not letting it fly.

With Reich and Siranni's routes, it's a trust and commitment thing, and the thing I have really been happy with this pre-season, guys are getting separation all over the place- this is the NFL, if you get 2.5 seconds and a guy that can separate, you damn well better be able to put that ball in his hands...I think they both have that capability.

VeveJones007 08-26-2019 01:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlwaysSunnyinIndy (Post 127765)
Reich and Sirianni were already working on that this preseason. Here was an article on colts.com that had quotes from both Reich and Sirianni from a few weeks ago.

https://www.colts.com/news/frank-rei...-training-camp

This particular quote was from Sirianni:

That’s a part he really struggled with at times in 2017. If he’s made solid improvements there, he could be a solid starter. I’m excited to see what he’s got. I figure we’ll have a pretty good feel by mid season one way or the other.

Colts And Orioles 10-20-2019 04:36 PM

o



This article was written on September 5th, just a few days before the start of the 2019 regular season ........




Take a Deep Breath, and Give Brissett a Chance

(By Danny Bridges)

http://www.indianapolisrecorder.com/...331c3ddb5.html


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Colts And Orioles 10-20-2019 06:39 PM

o


(vs. TEXANS, 10/20)


Jacoby Brissett became just the 3rd QB in franchise history (1953 - Present) to have thrown 4 TD passes, 0 INT's, and 300 or more yards in a single game.


The other 2 to have done so ......... Johnny Unitas and Peyton Manning.




SOURCE: ) ESPN News Services


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Spike 10-20-2019 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colts And Orioles (Post 138212)
o


(vs. TEXANS, 10/20)


Jacoby Brissett became just the 3rd QB in franchise history (1953 - Present) to have thrown 4 TD passes, 0 INT's, and 300 or more yards in a single game.


The other 2 to have done so ......... Johnny Unitas and Peyton Manning.






SOURCE: ) ESPN News Services


o

That's pretty damn elite company right there.

ChoppedWood 10-20-2019 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spike (Post 138213)
That's pretty damn elite company right there.

Not bad at all...

JAFF 10-20-2019 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChoppedWood (Post 138214)
Not bad at all...

Hes got a long way to go before hes cemented with those 2. Great team win, but hes got a long way to go

DragonTails 10-20-2019 09:26 PM

over/under td passes before season started was 19.

ChoppedWood 10-20-2019 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DragonTails (Post 138264)
over/under td passes before season started was 19.

65% Comp % 14 TD's, 3 INT and a 101 rating- that's not real shitty. The 14 TD's have him tied for 4th in the league in that category BTW.

ChoppedWood 10-20-2019 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChoppedWood (Post 138265)
65% Comp % 14 TD's, 3 INT and a 101 rating- that's not real shitty. The 14 TD's have him tied for 4th in the league in that category BTW.

And both Ryan and Wilson have played 7 games to JB's 6. Mahomes still has 1 more than JB and really he's played 6 games as well since he went out so early in the game Thurs.

albany ed 10-21-2019 06:08 AM

There are a few things to like about JB, and a little bit to hope he can improve. So far this year, he's kept the INTs down, (Luck was always good for 1 or 2 a game). He's learned to throw the ball away and not force passes when the coverage is superior. He's got a very strong arm. He's improving as the season goes on.

Some things I see that need improvement but can and will be improved. His touch on the quick short passes. His ability to go through his progressions. His ability to come to the line and see the weak point in the D and audible.

The one thing that won't change. He's surprisingly slow for an athlete with his build.

For me, the bottom line is that I don't think JB will ever be an elite NFL QB, but that may end up being his greatest value. When it comes time for a new contract, he'll command a substantial raise, but not a bank breaking salary that forces a team to let other important parts of the team seek greener pastures elsewhere. Thus, we can keep the nucleus of this team together and continue to get stronger.

It was fun last year to see the OL get better and better as the season went on and the young players gelled. This year we seem to be seeing the same thing with the young defensive players. It gives me faith in Ballard's ability to draft a great team and to have players that are very good but should be affordable. This team is growing, and they're growing fast, it's a lot of fun to see it.

Pez 10-21-2019 07:00 AM

The newspaper had a stat that brissett was 26 for 39, with six throwaways. Call that a soft 26 for 33 and zero picks.

Soon the media will stop adding ", who replaced Andrew Luck" when they write articles about him.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

YDFL Commish 10-21-2019 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by albany ed (Post 138286)
There are a few things to like about JB, and a little bit to hope he can improve. So far this year, he's kept the INTs down, (Luck was always good for 1 or 2 a game). He's learned to throw the ball away and not force passes when the coverage is superior. He's got a very strong arm. He's improving as the season goes on.

Some things I see that need improvement but can and will be improved. His touch on the quick short passes. His ability to go through his progressions. His ability to come to the line and see the weak point in the D and audible.

The one thing that won't change. He's surprisingly slow for an athlete with his build.

For me, the bottom line is that I don't think JB will ever be an elite NFL QB, but that may end up being his greatest value. When it comes time for a new contract, he'll command a substantial raise, but not a bank breaking salary that forces a team to let other important parts of the team seek greener pastures elsewhere. Thus, we can keep the nucleus of this team together and continue to get stronger.

It was fun last year to see the OL get better and better as the season went on and the young players gelled. This year we seem to be seeing the same thing with the young defensive players. It gives me faith in Ballard's ability to draft a great team and to have players that are very good but should be affordable. This team is growing, and they're growing fast, it's a lot of fun to see it.

The other area that Brissett could improve on, is his ability to throw on the run. It was one of Luck's biggest strengths and definitely would take Brissett to the next level with improvement.

Oldcolt 10-21-2019 11:02 AM

Albany Ed got it right in my opinion (Brissett not totally breaking the bank allowing us to actually have a TEAM) Once Mahomes gets a new contract it is going to be very difficult for KC to have a complete team. Plus one of his great attributes is his ability to escape. The only qb I've seen who kept this thruout his career was Fran Tarkenton. Brissett isn't fast but he is strong as a horse. He won't lose that. His ability to not turn the ball over is huge. It is thing he is better at than our last qb.

Chaka 10-21-2019 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by albany ed (Post 138286)
There are a few things to like about JB, and a little bit to hope he can improve. So far this year, he's kept the INTs down, (Luck was always good for 1 or 2 a game). He's learned to throw the ball away and not force passes when the coverage is superior. He's got a very strong arm. He's improving as the season goes on.

Some things I see that need improvement but can and will be improved. His touch on the quick short passes. His ability to go through his progressions. His ability to come to the line and see the weak point in the D and audible.

The one thing that won't change. He's surprisingly slow for an athlete with his build.

For me, the bottom line is that I don't think JB will ever be an elite NFL QB, but that may end up being his greatest value. When it comes time for a new contract, he'll command a substantial raise, but not a bank breaking salary that forces a team to let other important parts of the team seek greener pastures elsewhere. Thus, we can keep the nucleus of this team together and continue to get stronger.

I'll admit that Brissett has been pleasant surprise so far. His 14-3 TD/INT ratio and a 65% completion rate are pluses and much better than expected. Luck, by the way, averaged less than 1 INT per game for his entire career, so he really wasn't INT prone either.

I still can't say that I trust Brissett to maintain this pace for the remainder of the year. Perhaps that's just my inherent bias against backup QBs who are suddenly thrust into the starting role - I just figure their weaknesses will eventually be exposed once the other teams get enough tape on them, and they'll eventually implode. I never really bought into Ballard's pre-season statements about Brissett being a "top 20" QB (which, when you think about it, really just means they thought he was the 20th best starting QB in the league, which itself isn't THAT great). The league hasn't figured him out so far, however, and he appears to be getting stronger.

In any event, Brissett's proven me wrong so far. Whatever his weaknesses, he's done the job better than expected. It's all made a little sweeter that we got him from NE as well, I must admit. Dorsett's played OK for them, but we got the better of that deal for sure.

Oldcolt 10-21-2019 04:23 PM

Luck had 83 interceptions in 86 games. Brissett has 10 in 29 games. Brissett throws about 1/3 the interceptions and averages about half the TD's (about 2 per game for Luck vs 1 per game for Brissett) Makes sense, Luck was a full on gunslinger, Brissett isn't in that mold. We can win with either, just in different ways.

Chaka 10-21-2019 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by albany ed (Post 138286)
For me, the bottom line is that I don't think JB will ever be an elite NFL QB, but that may end up being his greatest value. When it comes time for a new contract, he'll command a substantial raise, but not a bank breaking salary that forces a team to let other important parts of the team seek greener pastures elsewhere. Thus, we can keep the nucleus of this team together and continue to get stronger.

By the way, I do think that if Brissett continues to play well, he WILL try his best to break the Colts' bank. I would do the same thing, so I don't expect anything different from Jacoby.

Maniac 10-21-2019 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oldcolt (Post 138389)
Luck had 83 interceptions in 86 games. Brissett has 10 in 29 games. Brissett throws about 1/3 the interceptions and averages about half the TD's (about 2 per game for Luck vs 1 per game for Brissett) Makes sense, Luck was a full on gunslinger, Brissett isn't in that mold. We can win with either, just in different ways.

We had to play that way with the teams that Luck was at the helm of. The running game sucked. The defense sucked. The coaching was AWFUL and put them in bad situations. Brissett has a balanced team with a very good offensive line and a good coaching staff. He doesn't need to take the chances that Luck had to take.

ChoppedWood 10-21-2019 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maniac (Post 138391)
We had to play that way with the teams that Luck was at the helm of. The running game sucked. The defense sucked. The coaching was AWFUL and put them in bad situations. Brissett has a balanced team with a very good offensive line and a good coaching staff. He doesn't need to take the chances that Luck had to take.

Boom!

ChoppedWood 10-21-2019 08:57 PM

I am thrilled with the play of Brissett to this point. He has played within the system and he has made the plays necessary to win games. We lost one game in OT and despite playing an overall blah game against the Raiders we were still in a position to tie it until he threw a bad INT- and then he STILL managed to throw a late game desperation TD to give us an onside chance.

To me the final piece will be how he responds to a real shitter of a game- and without question there is going to be one. I'm talking a 3 INT, 35-10 beat down game where he gets sacked and just looks like shit. If he bounces back from one of those- then we'll know we have the QB we need to lead this team for the long haul. Peyton had those games and you never worried that it would impact his long term trajectory and the next game out he would go for 400 and 4. That's the last piece of the JB mosiac I am looking for.

albany ed 10-22-2019 05:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chaka (Post 138390)
By the way, I do think that if Brissett continues to play well, he WILL try his best to break the Colts' bank. I would do the same thing, so I don't expect anything different from Jacoby.

IMO, Jacoby will never be at Luck's level. Luck piloted a weak and uninspired team. His talents and nearly his talents alone lifted the team to the playoffs. Jacoby pilots a young, talented team with one of the best OLs in the game and what appears to be a great coach. I like Jacoby and I want him to continue to grow and lead this team, but not at the expense of a top five QB salary. I wouldn't pay him at that rate and I don't think any team in the NFL would, unless he improves by LEAPS AND BOUNDS over his current abilities.

Hoopsdoc 10-22-2019 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chaka (Post 138379)
I'll admit that Brissett has been pleasant surprise so far. His 14-3 TD/INT ratio and a 65% completion rate are pluses and much better than expected. Luck, by the way, averaged less than 1 INT per game for his entire career, so he really wasn't INT prone either.

I still can't say that I trust Brissett to maintain this pace for the remainder of the year. Perhaps that's just my inherent bias against backup QBs who are suddenly thrust into the starting role - I just figure their weaknesses will eventually be exposed once the other teams get enough tape on them, and they'll eventually implode. I never really bought into Ballard's pre-season statements about Brissett being a "top 20" QB (which, when you think about it, really just means they thought he was the 20th best starting QB in the league, which itself isn't THAT great). The league hasn't figured him out so far, however, and he appears to be getting stronger.

In any event, Brissett's proven me wrong so far. Whatever his weaknesses, he's done the job better than expected. It's all made a little sweeter that we got him from NE as well, I must admit. Dorsett's played OK for them, but we got the better of that deal for sure.

There is well over a full season of tape on Brissett out there already.

Racehorse 10-22-2019 07:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChoppedWood (Post 138420)
I am thrilled with the play of Brissett to this point. He has played within the system and he has made the plays necessary to win games. We lost one game in OT and despite playing an overall blah game against the Raiders we were still in a position to tie it until he threw a bad INT- and then he STILL managed to throw a late game desperation TD to give us an onside chance.

To me the final piece will be how he responds to a real shitter of a game- and without question there is going to be one. I'm talking a 3 INT, 35-10 beat down game where he gets sacked and just looks like shit. If he bounces back from one of those- then we'll know we have the QB we need to lead this team for the long haul. Peyton had those games and you never worried that it would impact his long term trajectory and the next game out he would go for 400 and 4. That's the last piece of the JB mosiac I am looking for.

I am NEVER looking for us to lose that badly.

Pez 10-22-2019 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChoppedWood (Post 138420)
I am thrilled with the play of Brissett to this point. He has played within the system and he has made the plays necessary to win games. We lost one game in OT and despite playing an overall blah game against the Raiders we were still in a position to tie it until he threw a bad INT- and then he STILL managed to throw a late game desperation TD to give us an onside chance.

To me the final piece will be how he responds to a real shitter of a game- and without question there is going to be one. I'm talking a 3 INT, 35-10 beat down game where he gets sacked and just looks like shit. If he bounces back from one of those- then we'll know we have the QB we need to lead this team for the long haul. Peyton had those games and you never worried that it would impact his long term trajectory and the next game out he would go for 400 and 4. That's the last piece of the JB mosiac I am looking for.

I take your point, but would argue that there were multiple such games in 2017. He started 8 days after signing, went on to a 4-12 record and was sacked 52 times.

I don't view that he has anything else to prove in terms of his resiliency.

Pez 10-22-2019 08:27 AM

Quietly, Brissett has:
4th most passing TDs in the league
3rd least interceptions
24th least pass attempts
I think a lot of the 'game manager' talk is just people latching on to a term and using it so they have something to say.

More accurately, Reich's game plan produces a different set of expectations from the Quarterback position than we see frequently. JB so far is filling the role. If Vinny had made one of his two missed FGs, or made his extra point In week 1, we would be a 5-1 team and the conversations about us would be different.

There's some interesting poultry going on: How much is Reich changing for Brissett and how mush is Brissett changing for Reich?


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