Vontae Davis / Jack Mewhort UFA's
 

Vontae Davis is a free agent after 2017 season. He turns 29 on May 27th of this year. Do you think Ballard will even try to sign him to an extension? His last deal was 4 years @ $36,000,000

Jack Mewhort is a free agent after 2017 season. He turns 26 on August 30th of this year. Do you think Ballard will try to sign him to an extension? Coming off of his rookie contract.

:cool:

depends on his health/durability

yes.

Mewhort is a no brainer but I think when it comes to Vontae a lot will be determined by his play this year.

Vontae needs to return to the more consistent shut-down corner he was prior to 2016.

Vontae = 30. Probably not.
Mewhort = 27 and is a linesman. Probably, unless he sucks.

VD- A lot depends on his health and the new kid, but I doubt it.

Mewhort- If he can stay healthy yes if not, doubtful.

i think davis should be brought back


mewhort will want too much money. he is a lg. no need to pay a lg 8 million plus a year

davis is probably 5 times the player mewhort is.

if anyone is a no brainer it is davis

Could be 5 times as expensive as well.

That's overstating it. Davis is a great player when healthy but not when he's struggling through injury.

Mewhort was terrible when he was on ir

What is your point

What if anything is offered to Davis depends on his season. He's been a top 10 CB for some time now. If that continues, he should be signed if possible. His age should dictate the offer somewhat. I hope he has a big year and I hope they can sign him, but not at a crazy and lengthy cost.

the league is valuing linemen to a higher degree because good pro style guys are getting harder to find. Not to mention the salary cap continuing to rise, $8 million for a guard in 5 years is going to look reasonable. The market determines value.

Much like Vontaes 4 year $36 million deal now. We paid a legitimate cb1 less than $10 million per, that seems crazy.

Further Jack's contract will be more than $10 million per. I know you don't love the guy but he's pretty good at what he does.

I don't know about that.

Currently, only 4 OGs have contracts that average more than $10m a season:

$12.000m = Kevin Zeitler, CLE (27 years old; signed in 2017)
$11.700m = Kelechi Osemele, OAK (27 years old; signed in 2016)
$10.000m = David DeCastro, PIT (27 years old; signed in 2016)
$10.000m = Kyle Long, CHI (28 years old, signed in 2016)

And there are only 5 more guys making an average of over $8m a year.

Zeitler's contract is out of whack because CLE had to spend a TON of cap space this off season and they signed a couple of guys to bigger contracts than the market probably dictated.

Unless you think that Mewhort is a top five OG (which while I think he is good, he is not even top ten or probably even top 15 in the NFL), then I don't think there is any way that he will be paid an average of $10m next season.

Cheers,

and a decade ago guards that made $5 million per were rare.

Contracts go up. Bottom line. The market will likely determine his value. In 5 years time a lot of guards are going to be making $10mil plus. The contracts last year will be the basis for contracts next year and they're only going to climb.

Further, are we really going to argue over 1 to 2 million per year when it can simply be pushed into a 5th year that we can always get out of?

I am talking about on-field performance. I understand that the injuries are real. I admire Davis for playing through them. But if your on the field you have to perform. Anything else has to be taken into consideration when you think about another contract. Davis has shown he can play at a very high level, at times maybe top 3 in the NFL. But he absolutely has not played at that level consistently, or a majority of his time here.

I am not arguing.

I am merely using facts to point out that I don't think Mewhort is going to cost the Colts $10m a year starting next year if they choose to re-sign him (and I think they should).

I think $7-$8m a year is a much more realistic price point based on where I think the OG market in the NFL is at. You think it will be $10m+.

Okay, 2 opinions on the board but I don't think it is arguing and in the long run, it does not really matter. Those are pretty small potatoes in the overall salary cap situation.

Cheers,

He has played like a top ten cb his whole time here. Outside of revis a few years ago, what cb is lock down great game in and game out?

Expectations for Davis are insane with fans

Let's see what his market value is at the end of the season. Personally, I want him on the team until he isn't valuable anymore.

The question, in my opinion, is how Valuable Davis is in Ballard's eyes. We'll know at the end of the season.

Mewhort is still a no brainer. He's the best guard on the roster.

I don't think mewhort is a no brainer at all. That is a hefty price for a lg. And he is good but not great

Davis has been great for the majority of his time with the Colts. Recently his play has dropped slightly, whether that is through injury or age. The question is whether he bounces back or if it is the start of his decline. That will determine any extension offer.

Ballard has said he wants to build this team through the offensive and defensive lines. Mewhort is one of their best players on the o-line and is very versatile. I imagine Ballard tries everything he can to keep him.

I agree, but in Mewhort's case, I would say that if Ballard believes he can be replaced, by anyone on the current roster, then he will get to test free agency.

I also think that we all get way ahead of ourselves trying to predict what will happen 6 to 10 months from now w/regard to the roster.

Injury issues are a concern as well.

I've never taken the time to really think about how other teams in the league value Mewhort.

I'd be a prick if I didn't admit Mewhort should be watched closely this year as well.

Perhaps he isn't a no brainer. You've watched this team longer than I have. Davis is the most talented corner I have seen play for Indianapolis, but I've seen the colts enjoy great success without elite cornerback play.

You have seen that. But that was a whole different system.

And don't get me wrong, I am all about building up the lines. Left guard is probably the last position on the line that I would dump money into. If we bring him back then great. I just think there is a price point I would have no problem saying bye.

When you have a franchise QB, everyone indicates that you need to get weapons for him....i disagree with this, as i think that a top notch QB can make WR's look much better than they really are, Tom Brady has done that for most of his career. I would rather have a really solid offensive line and TE giving him that extra half a second for mediocre receivers to get open. I think a quality running game helps a QB way more than having outstanding receivers, sure having great receivers is the dream, but forcing a defense to have to send extra guys to create a pass rush, creates holes in the defense, or a good running game, makes a defense put 8 men in the box etc, which gives a top quality QB the opportunity to go over the top for the home run.

Assuming Mewhort can stay healthy and plays to the levels he has, or better, then i say it is a no brainer to resign him, especially as we ought to have a fairly healthy salary cap situation again next year. Continuity on the offensive line is also a major thing for good Oline play.

In 2018, the Colts currently have 13 guys who are signed to veteran (5th year and beyond) contracts: Luck, Castonzo, Hilton, Hankins, Sheard, Simon, Doyle, Langford, Woods, Hunt, Locke and Turbin.

In 2018, the Colts currently have 20 guys who are signed to rookie contracts as Colt draftees: Kelly, Dorsett, Green, Anderson, Geathers, Clark, Ridgeway, Parry, Morrison, Good, Haeg, Blythe, Hooker, Wilson, Basham, Banner, Mack, Stewart, Hairston and Walker.

In 2018, the Colts currently have 42 guys who were UDFA or street free agents in the first 4 years of their NFL career: Mount, Bray, McGill, Ferguson, Vujnovich, Morris, Swoope, Sokoli, Jackson, Farley, Milton, Rhodes, Rogers, Smith, Maggitt, Williams, Sanchez, Wiliamson, Cage, Mitchel, Cooper, Leak, Redmond, Hightower, Dainels, Walker, Bond, Radcliff, Thomas, Howard, Crossan, Muller, Ugokwe, Jeter, Griffey, Sickels, Porter, Gibbons, Hester, Lyles, Hennessy, Allie-Cox.

For those keeping track, that means that 62 out of 75 guys currently signed for 2018 have less than 4 years experience in the NFL. Thanks Grigson!

Assuming that the cap rises in 2018 by roughly the same amount it has over the past three years, then the NFL salary cap should be around $174m next year. The 2017 Colts would currently roll upwards of $15m into 2018 of 2017 money and our current 2018 obligations are sitting at $107m, that leaves:

$82.000 million Free Cap Space in 2018

Colts UFAs in 2018 include:

Current Starters:
CB Vontae Davis
OG Jack Mewhort
WR Donte Moncrief
PK Adam Vinatieri
RB Frank Gore
FS Darius Butler

Possible Starters / Possible Quality Depth:
OLB Akeem Ayers
OLB Barkevious Mingo
WR Kamar Aiken
QB Scott Tolzien
ILB Jon Bostic
OG Brian Schwenke
CB Rashaan Melvin

Depth Guys:
DE Lavar Edwards
TE Brandon Williams
CB Darryl Morris

More than enough to re-sign our guys and find a couple of gems in free agency.

Cheers,

grigson had his issues, but at least he didnt leave us in cap hell!

I think he deferred the actual contract constructs to someone else.

Unless these players have setbacks due to injury or performance you
resign them both, even if that means slightly overpaying them. Neither of the units these players represent are brimming with proven talent. Hopefully one
of these days we'll be in the position of NE where BB can put on his accountant's visor and look an incumbent
player in the eye and tell him I'm paying you this and not a penny more,
knowing there is a replacement in the pipeline. We're not there yet. Not even close.

I think you are overestimating my criticism, or I am not communicating well. I like Davis. And he has been in a bad position, the best player on a terrible defense. I am hopeful that with some new talent on the roster he will be able to play more consistently at a high level.

At his best, in 2014, he was talked about as possibly the best corner in the league. I remember him going on a streak of over 1000 snaps without giving up a TD. His 2015 and 2016 seasons weren't at that level. He was targeted at times. Some of those big plays the Colts defense gave up were passes to his man. I don't think I am being harsh or unrealistic, I'm just stating what happened.

We'll see how he does in 2017. He's never been a turnovers guy, he's a coverage corner that does well in run support. When his athleticism begins going downhill, his strengths will go with it. So he's not a player you can sign to a top 3 corner contract. He hasn't played at that level most of his career, and his age has to be a factor.

And my point in talking about Davis' shortcomings was this ridiculous idea you brought up about how Davis is 5x the player Mewhort is. First it's dumb to compare a corner to a guard like that. Second, I know you think the white-loving Colts fans overrate Mewhort, but this is your blind spot. You let what fans say affect how you view the actual player. Mewhort is a good player. Kevin Zeitler got $12M/year in FA this offseason. $8M/year for Mewhort in 2018 will not be a bad price to pay, the cap goes way up every year now.

I mentioned before, I am hoping Wilson emerges as a solid starter and we see Davis move to #2 corner and Wilson #1 in coming seasons.

As much as I cringed every time last week I saw more back and forth on this subject, I found this article from NBC Sports pretty interesting regarding Guard pay.