2019 NFL Salary Cap announced - $188.2MM

[AlwaysSunnyinIndy]

The salary cap for 2019 is set at $188.2MM.

It is an increase of $11MM from last year’s figure of $177.2MM.


https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1101606189937451008

[Puck]

Wow. jagoffs are hurting


http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001020137/article/nfl-salary-cap-for-2019-season-set-at-1882m

[Racehorse]

Wow. jagoffs are hurting


http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001020137/article/nfl-salary-cap-for-2019-season-set-at-1882m

I guess that means they wont be signing Nick Foles. This makes me glad.

Unless they want to gut the team, there is no way they have any money to sign anyone. Even cutting Bortles will not save them enough.

[YDFL Commish]

I guess that means they wont be signing Nick Foles. This makes me glad.

Unless they want to gut the team, there is no way they have any money to sign anyone. Even cutting Bortles will not save them enough.

Yeah, I'm guessing a minimum of $20 million to sign Foles.

[Puck]

I’m guessing and hoping Sherk can work the numbers in them and the rest of the division and tell what kind of shape all of them are in and who they may release etc

[AlwaysSunnyinIndy]

Wow. jagoffs are hurting


http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001020137/article/nfl-salary-cap-for-2019-season-set-at-1882m


Jax restructured Marcel Dareus's contract last week so they should be under the cap now (Overthecap.com hasn't updated his contract yet with the new details). However, they definitely have a lot of decisions to make on contract restructures, trades and outright cuts to gain any type of flexibility at all.

https://twitter.com/FieldYates/status/1100738615863332864

[JAFF]

http://overthecap.com/

[Chromeburn]

I guess that means they wont be signing Nick Foles. This makes me glad.

Unless they want to gut the team, there is no way they have any money to sign anyone. Even cutting Bortles will not save them enough.

Rumors are they are going after him as soon as FA starts. I don’t know how they will sign him, but they are going to try.

[Maniac]

Rumors are they are going after him as soon as FA starts. I don’t know how they will sign him, but they are going to try.

cbs sportsline is reporting that the jags are the only team bidding for him, which just doesn't make sense. Can't believe the giants, dolphins or someone else isn't interested at all.

[Dewey 5]

cbs sportsline is reporting that the jags are the only team bidding for him, which just doesn't make sense. Can't believe the giants, dolphins or someone else isn't interested at all.

Dolphins might be tanking for Justin Herbert or Tua. The top qb prospect Trevor Lawrence isn't draft eligible until 2021

[Chromeburn]

Dolphins might be tanking for Justin Herbert or Tua. The top qb prospect Trevor Lawrence isn't draft eligible until 2021

Lawrence will be the best prospect since Luck.

[Racehorse]

Rumors are they are going after him as soon as FA starts. I don’t know how they will sign him, but they are going to try.

I saw that. Wonder where they plan to get the cap space.

[Chromeburn]

I saw that. Wonder where they plan to get the cap space.

They will probably trade some of the problem children they have there. They did not handle success well.

Still drafting a QB would be the cheaper way to go, but I guess their window slips while he is developing.

[JAFF]

They will probably trade some of the problem children they have there. They did not handle success well.

Still drafting a QB would be the cheaper way to go, but I guess their window slips while he is developing.

Cut some? I know the money is different when you cut somebody, but I suppose they will eat a bunch of $$ no matter what?

[sherck]

Rumors are they are going after him as soon as FA starts. I don’t know how they will sign him, but they are going to try.
I don’t have a ton of time but here is a quick and dirty on JAX cap situation:

$188.200m = NFL 2019 Salary Cap
$011.600m = Rollover from 2018 for JAX
===========
$199.800m = 2019 JAX Salary Cap

$197.057m = Current contracts for top 51 players
$005.515m = Projected draft pool (projected draft cap hits minus 7x players make cap minimum)
$002.478m = Dead money
$001.200m = Spots 52 / 53 on regular season roster
$001.200m = 10-man practice squad
$003.000m = 2019 in season “churn” space
============
$210.450m = 2019 JAX Obligations

Free Cap Space = - 10.650m

Obviously, right now, every projection is going to show them under the salary cap because the draft class, spots 52 & 53, practice squad and churn space don’t count yet. But they will…..they will.

So, to realistically sign Foles, they need to account for all their 2019 expenditures AND have a minimum of $20m in free cap space to sign him….all without wrecking the team.

Top JAX 2019 free agents:
WR Donte Moncrief
TE Austin Seferian-Jenkins
TE James O’Shaughnessy
RB Corey Grant
RB T.J. Yeldon
OG A.J. Cann

Some guys there that are probably starters if they had not ended the season on IR (Moncrief, Seferian-Jenkins, Cann) so if they re-sign any of those guys, they need to create more space to do so.

Top 10 cap savings if cut:
$11.000m = DT Malik Jackson
$09.500m = DE Calais Campbell
$09.406m = CB A.J. Bouye
$07.450m = FS Tashaun Gipson
$06.000m = RT Jermey Parnell
$05.781m = OC Brandon Linder
$04.700m = RB Carlos Hyde
$04.500m = QB Blake Bortles
$04.130m = LB Telvin Smith
$04.000m = DT Taven Bryan

Cutting folks outright saves the most cap space but also wrecks the team.

They can do more of what they did with Marcell Dareus. They converted $5.000m of his 2019 salary into a signing bonus in order to spread it over the 2 remaining years of his deal (2019 and 2020) in order to spread the cap hit evenly and save $2.500m against the cap. That got them under the salary cap at the start of the NFL season (barely).

Andrew Norwell – 4 years remaining on contract. Convert $10m of his $13m 2019 salary into signing bonus and spread for an additional cap hit of $2.5m in 2019/2020/2021/2022 while saving $7.5m in 2019.

A.J. Boyue – 3 years remaining on contract. Convert $12m of his $13m 2019 salary into signing bonus and spread for an additional cap hit of $4m in 2019/2020/2021 while saving $8m in 2019.

Blake Bortles – 2 years remaining on contract. Convert $10m of his $14m 2019 salary into signing bonus and spread for an additional cap hit of $5m in 2019/2020 while saving $5m in 2019. OR….cut to save $4.5m.

Malik Jackson – 3 years remaining on contract. Convert $12m of his $13m 2019 salary into signing bonus and spread for an additional cap hit of $4m in 2019/2020/2021 while saving $8m in 2019.

That is around $28m in cap space created to get them out of the hole and sign Foles. There is more they would have to do in order to keep their team intact, but you get the point.

Obviously, this is only making the problem worse into the future but I think that JAX could chose to do this for 2019 and 2020 before it all falls apart in 2021 and you are looking at a MAJOR salary and talent dump and rebuild. 2 year window for them to compete with their current talent.

So, if JAX wants Foles, they can afford him by pushing a lot of cap obligations into the future while at the same time keeping their team together. For one or two seasons.

Walk Worthy,

[Maniac]

I don’t have a ton of time but here is a quick and dirty on JAX cap situation:

$188.200m = NFL 2019 Salary Cap
$011.600m = Rollover from 2018 for JAX
===========
$199.800m = 2019 JAX Salary Cap

$197.057m = Current contracts for top 51 players
$005.515m = Projected draft pool (projected draft cap hits minus 7x players make cap minimum)
$002.478m = Dead money
$001.200m = Spots 52 / 53 on regular season roster
$001.200m = 10-man practice squad
$003.000m = 2019 in season “churn” space
============
$210.450m = 2019 JAX Obligations

Free Cap Space = - 10.650m

Obviously, right now, every projection is going to show them under the salary cap because the draft class, spots 52 & 53, practice squad and churn space don’t count yet. But they will…..they will.

So, to realistically sign Foles, they need to account for all their 2019 expenditures AND have a minimum of $20m in free cap space to sign him….all without wrecking the team.

Top JAX 2019 free agents:
WR Donte Moncrief
TE Austin Seferian-Jenkins
TE James O’Shaughnessy
RB Corey Grant
RB T.J. Yeldon
OG A.J. Cann

Some guys there that are probably starters if they had not ended the season on IR (Moncrief, Seferian-Jenkins, Cann) so if they re-sign any of those guys, they need to create more space to do so.

Top 10 cap savings if cut:
$11.000m = DT Malik Jackson
$09.500m = DE Calais Campbell
$09.406m = CB A.J. Bouye
$07.450m = FS Tashaun Gipson
$06.000m = RT Jermey Parnell
$05.781m = OC Brandon Linder
$04.700m = RB Carlos Hyde
$04.500m = QB Blake Bortles
$04.130m = LB Telvin Smith
$04.000m = DT Taven Bryan

Cutting folks outright saves the most cap space but also wrecks the team.

They can do more of what they did with Marcell Dareus. They converted $5.000m of his 2019 salary into a signing bonus in order to spread it over the 2 remaining years of his deal (2019 and 2020) in order to spread the cap hit evenly and save $2.500m against the cap. That got them under the salary cap at the start of the NFL season (barely).

Andrew Norwell – 4 years remaining on contract. Convert $10m of his $13m 2019 salary into signing bonus and spread for an additional cap hit of $2.5m in 2019/2020/2021/2022 while saving $7.5m in 2019.

A.J. Boyue – 3 years remaining on contract. Convert $12m of his $13m 2019 salary into signing bonus and spread for an additional cap hit of $4m in 2019/2020/2021 while saving $8m in 2019.

Blake Bortles – 2 years remaining on contract. Convert $10m of his $14m 2019 salary into signing bonus and spread for an additional cap hit of $5m in 2019/2020 while saving $5m in 2019. OR….cut to save $4.5m.

Malik Jackson – 3 years remaining on contract. Convert $12m of his $13m 2019 salary into signing bonus and spread for an additional cap hit of $4m in 2019/2020/2021 while saving $8m in 2019.

That is around $28m in cap space created to get them out of the hole and sign Foles. There is more they would have to do in order to keep their team intact, but you get the point.

Obviously, this is only making the problem worse into the future but I think that JAX could chose to do this for 2019 and 2020 before it all falls apart in 2021 and you are looking at a MAJOR salary and talent dump and rebuild. 2 year window for them to compete with their current talent.

So, if JAX wants Foles, they can afford him by pushing a lot of cap obligations into the future while at the same time keeping their team together. For one or two seasons.

Walk Worthy,

Colts are setting themselves up for a decade of success. Jags are setting themselves up for another decade of failure.

[Chaka]

I don’t have a ton of time but here is a quick and dirty on JAX cap situation:

$188.200m = NFL 2019 Salary Cap
$011.600m = Rollover from 2018 for JAX
===========
$199.800m = 2019 JAX Salary Cap

$197.057m = Current contracts for top 51 players
$005.515m = Projected draft pool (projected draft cap hits minus 7x players make cap minimum)
$002.478m = Dead money
$001.200m = Spots 52 / 53 on regular season roster
$001.200m = 10-man practice squad
$003.000m = 2019 in season “churn” space
============
$210.450m = 2019 JAX Obligations

Free Cap Space = - 10.650m

Obviously, right now, every projection is going to show them under the salary cap because the draft class, spots 52 & 53, practice squad and churn space don’t count yet. But they will…..they will.

So, to realistically sign Foles, they need to account for all their 2019 expenditures AND have a minimum of $20m in free cap space to sign him….all without wrecking the team.

Top JAX 2019 free agents:
WR Donte Moncrief
TE Austin Seferian-Jenkins
TE James O’Shaughnessy
RB Corey Grant
RB T.J. Yeldon
OG A.J. Cann

Some guys there that are probably starters if they had not ended the season on IR (Moncrief, Seferian-Jenkins, Cann) so if they re-sign any of those guys, they need to create more space to do so.

Top 10 cap savings if cut:
$11.000m = DT Malik Jackson
$09.500m = DE Calais Campbell
$09.406m = CB A.J. Bouye
$07.450m = FS Tashaun Gipson
$06.000m = RT Jermey Parnell
$05.781m = OC Brandon Linder
$04.700m = RB Carlos Hyde
$04.500m = QB Blake Bortles
$04.130m = LB Telvin Smith
$04.000m = DT Taven Bryan

Cutting folks outright saves the most cap space but also wrecks the team.

They can do more of what they did with Marcell Dareus. They converted $5.000m of his 2019 salary into a signing bonus in order to spread it over the 2 remaining years of his deal (2019 and 2020) in order to spread the cap hit evenly and save $2.500m against the cap. That got them under the salary cap at the start of the NFL season (barely).

Andrew Norwell – 4 years remaining on contract. Convert $10m of his $13m 2019 salary into signing bonus and spread for an additional cap hit of $2.5m in 2019/2020/2021/2022 while saving $7.5m in 2019.

A.J. Boyue – 3 years remaining on contract. Convert $12m of his $13m 2019 salary into signing bonus and spread for an additional cap hit of $4m in 2019/2020/2021 while saving $8m in 2019.

Blake Bortles – 2 years remaining on contract. Convert $10m of his $14m 2019 salary into signing bonus and spread for an additional cap hit of $5m in 2019/2020 while saving $5m in 2019. OR….cut to save $4.5m.

Malik Jackson – 3 years remaining on contract. Convert $12m of his $13m 2019 salary into signing bonus and spread for an additional cap hit of $4m in 2019/2020/2021 while saving $8m in 2019.

That is around $28m in cap space created to get them out of the hole and sign Foles. There is more they would have to do in order to keep their team intact, but you get the point.

Obviously, this is only making the problem worse into the future but I think that JAX could chose to do this for 2019 and 2020 before it all falls apart in 2021 and you are looking at a MAJOR salary and talent dump and rebuild. 2 year window for them to compete with their current talent.

So, if JAX wants Foles, they can afford him by pushing a lot of cap obligations into the future while at the same time keeping their team together. For one or two seasons.

Walk Worthy,

Take note - JAX is an example of why you don't build your team through free agency. Several here were touting JAX as an example of successfully utilizing free agency to make a competitive team, and while they looked good for a year or two, but they're now dealing with the consequences of all of that spending. Keep in mind that just 2-3 years ago JAX was leading the league in available cap space, just like the Colts are now.

[Luck4Reich]

Listening to radio this morning they said Jags are signing him next week. I caught tail end of the show driving to work.

[sherck]

Listening to radio this morning they said Jags are signing him next week. I caught tail end of the show driving to work.

Yeah, I have seen a couple of articles about how it is a "done deal" and will be below market value in the $18m - $20m range.

They are going to need to resturcture quite a few contracts to make that happen.

Walk Worthy,

[Dam8610]

I know teams aren't required to designate franchise players until 4 PM eastern tomorrow, but it's been very quiet thus far. I'm surprised that Dee Ford and Robbie Gould are the only designees thus far.

[AlwaysSunnyinIndy]

I know teams aren't required to designate franchise players until 4 PM eastern tomorrow, but it's been very quiet thus far. I'm surprised that Dee Ford and Robbie Gould are the only designees thus far.


Tampa Bay is tagging LT Donovan Smith.

https://twitter.com/NFLSTROUD/status/1102570767814934532

[rcubed]

Yeah, I have seen a couple of articles about how it is a "done deal" and will be below market value in the $18m - $20m range.

They are going to need to resturcture quite a few contracts to make that happen.

Walk Worthy,
eh. he will most likely return to regular-season-nick vs. save-our-season-nick.

[AlwaysSunnyinIndy]

I know teams aren't required to designate franchise players until 4 PM eastern tomorrow, but it's been very quiet thus far. I'm surprised that Dee Ford and Robbie Gould are the only designees thus far.


Houston just tagged Jadeveon Clowney as well.

https://twitter.com/HoustonTexans/status/1102633836956008451

[Dewey 5]

Houston just tagged Jadeveon Clowney as well.

https://twitter.com/HoustonTexans/status/1102633836956008451

Not a surprise. I'm sure Dallas will tag Demarcus Lawrence as well. The one guy the Colts might have a shot as is Frank Clark.

[AlwaysSunnyinIndy]

The one guy the Colts might have a shot as is Frank Clark.

Over the weekend, there were reports that Frank Clark and Seattle were making progress towards a long term deal.

https://twitter.com/JasonLaCanfora/status/1101802340150140928


Pete Carroll has also stated that Clark will be on Seattle's roster in 2019 either by new contract or by franchise tag.

[smitty46953]

Take note - JAX is an example of why you don't build your team through free agency. Several here were touting JAX as an example of successfully utilizing free agency to make a competitive team, and while they looked good for a year or two, but they're now dealing with the consequences of all of that spending. Keep in mind that just 2-3 years ago JAX was leading the league in available cap space, just like the Colts are now.

Yet, there will be armchair GM's bitching about our lack of spending during the free agent period. :cool:

[Dewey 5]

Over the weekend, there were reports that Frank Clark and Seattle were making progress towards a long term deal.

https://twitter.com/JasonLaCanfora/status/1101802340150140928


Pete Carroll has also stated that Clark will be on Seattle's roster in 2019 either by new contract or by franchise tag.

There you have it. Now everyone will be pissed when Ballard doesn't spend money. If the players aren't there you just can't throw money around.

[VeveJones007]

It's crazy that the Colts could sign Flowers, Collins, and Tyrell Williams and still have 50% of their cap space remaining. But I guess that's what happens when you don't have to sign players to 2nd contracts. Grigson was such a fuck up.

[Johanvil]

How much cap space Ballard will be rolling from this season into 2020 you reckon?

[sherck]

How much cap space Ballard will be rolling from this season into 2020 you reckon?
So, right now, assuming the 2020 cap rises on average what it has over the past three years, the cap will be around $198m.

Current 2020 obligations on the 35 folks who have contracts will be around $90m (once the 5th year option on Kelly is exercised). Add in this season's nine man draft class and that set of obligations rises to around $96m.

So, even without rolling any of 2019 cap into 2020, the Colts will be working with around $100m of 2020 money in free cap space. That amount will be reduced by signings this season that have not happened yet carrying into 2020 and the need to re-sign some of our own in 2020 (Castonzo, Sheard, Ebron, Doyle, Clark, Haeg, Ridgeway).

So, Ballard probably needs to carry a minimum $25m of 2019 unused cap over into 2020 in order to have the flexibility of signing our own in 2020.

However, my guess is that it will be more than that because, seriously, how is he going to spend $75m in free agency this off-season will the majority of the pass rushers tagged?

My guess? $50m rolled over to 2020.

Walk Worthy,

[Chromeburn]

Take note - JAX is an example of why you don't build your team through free agency. Several here were touting JAX as an example of successfully utilizing free agency to make a competitive team, and while they looked good for a year or two, but they're now dealing with the consequences of all of that spending. Keep in mind that just 2-3 years ago JAX was leading the league in available cap space, just like the Colts are now.

I think they are an example of going for broke. If they win a Superbowl, is it worth it? With competent QB play they are better than the pats. I think the pats are a better example of building through FA consistently, because they are mediocre at drafting.

[Chromeburn]

It's crazy that the Colts could sign Flowers, Collins, and Tyrell Williams and still have 50% of their cap space remaining. But I guess that's what happens when you don't have to sign players to 2nd contracts. Grigson was such a fuck up.

All he had to do was draft players they could develop, they didn't even have to be starters right away. He couldn't even do that. Couldn't build a line even though he went through countless picks and FA's. Couldn't build a D. Had a good draft that first draft, then that was it. I bet that draft was more Telesco than him.

Yet, there will be armchair GM's bitching about our lack of spending during the free agent period. :cool:

Those people just want action and think just by signing guys we will be better. Ballard will probably do what he did last year. Go after a couple of top guys, but won't overspend. Then wait and see how the market shakes out. Then find some quality guys looking for more of a starting role after developing for a couple of years.

[YDFL Commish]

The difference between this year and last is that the winning culture has been established and FA's now know that with a healthy Luck, a dominant OL and good coaching that they could be joining a future champion.

[Coltsalr]

Take note - JAX is an example of why you don't build your team through free agency. Several here were touting JAX as an example of successfully utilizing free agency to make a competitive team, and while they looked good for a year or two, but they're now dealing with the consequences of all of that spending. Keep in mind that just 2-3 years ago JAX was leading the league in available cap space, just like the Colts are now.

On the other hand, the Broncos went for broke in free agency and won the Super Bowl. The Rams went for broke and had Goff not shit the bed they’d also be (mercifully) Super Bowl champs right now.

[Dam8610]

On the other hand, the Broncos went for broke in free agency and won the Super Bowl. The Rams went for broke and had Goff not shit the bed they’d also be (mercifully) Super Bowl champs right now.

The Broncos and Rams also drafted well in those time frames. Both teams, despite adding significantly in free agency, still had mostly drafted starters. Both teams started with good core pieces and supplemented that with free agents. Jacksonville built their core through free agency, which is why their run was so short and fell apart so quickly.

[Coltsalr]

The Broncos and Rams also drafted well in those time frames. Both teams, despite adding significantly in free agency, still had mostly drafted starters. Both teams started with good core pieces and supplemented that with free agents. Jacksonville built their core through free agency, which is why their run was so short and fell apart so quickly.

Yeah, absolutely. And the Colts have now finally drafted well under Ballard.

Augment another solid draft with a couple of splash signings like the Broncos/Rams had (say if we got Flowers/Collins and then Christian Wilkins/AJ Brown as the top two picks) and this will be a dangerous team.

[Chaka]

I think they are an example of going for broke. If they win a Superbowl, is it worth it? With competent QB play they are better than the pats. I think the pats are a better example of building through FA consistently, because they are mediocre at drafting.

If I win the lottery, was it worth buying a ticket? It's a silly question. Just because the ultimate outcome ends up being good doesn't mean it was a smart decision. Every lottery winner would be a genius!

Furthermore, JAX didn't have a lot of free agent busts either - so their failures can't be blamed on poor free agent talent evaluation. It's just that excessive spending has put them in a box that will handcuff them for the next few years and severely limit their chances of getting better. And the point is that the Colts could end up the same way if they try to go for the easy fix and don't maintain financial discipline and stay true to their philosophy.

As for the Pats, well, I don't give them much credit for anything given their methods, so I won't accept them as an example of anything good or right...

[smitty46953]

Wow. jagoffs are hurting


http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001020137/article/nfl-salary-cap-for-2019-season-set-at-1882m

Jags have released DT Malik Jackson, S Tashaun Gipson, RT Jermey Parnell, LS Carson Tinker and RB Carlos Hyde.

Trying to get enough cap space to sign Foles I imagine ???

They did re-sign ex-Colt long snapper Matt Overton :cool:

[sherck]

Malik Jackson? Sure, he is 29 years old but still a quality guy to put in a DT rotation!

That would be one I will be interested to see if Ballard kicks the tires.

Walk Worthy,

[Chromeburn]

If I win the lottery, was it worth buying a ticket? It's a silly question. Just because the ultimate outcome ends up being good doesn't mean it was a smart decision. Every lottery winner would be a genius!

Furthermore, JAX didn't have a lot of free agent busts either - so their failures can't be blamed on poor free agent talent evaluation. It's just that excessive spending has put them in a box that will handcuff them for the next few years and severely limit their chances of getting better. And the point is that the Colts could end up the same way if they try to go for the easy fix and don't maintain financial discipline and stay true to their philosophy.

As for the Pats, well, I don't give them much credit for anything given their methods, so I won't accept them as an example of anything good or right...

So if they win the Superbowl, they still should not have done it?

[Chromeburn]

On the other hand, the Broncos went for broke in free agency and won the Super Bowl. The Rams went for broke and had Goff not shit the bed they’d also be (mercifully) Super Bowl champs right now.

The Broncos and Rams also drafted well in those time frames. Both teams, despite adding significantly in free agency, still had mostly drafted starters. Both teams started with good core pieces and supplemented that with free agents. Jacksonville built their core through free agency, which is why their run was so short and fell apart so quickly.

But the Jags have drafted well previously also. Jalen Ramsey is their best player, Myles Jack, Smith, Fournette, Ronnie Harrison I think will be good, etc. They were not just built through FA. Their biggest problem is not hitting on a QB and not handling success well. If they had drafted Derek Carr instead of Bortles they might have a Superbowl now. They should not have given Bortles that huge contract.

It would be one thing if signing FA's to push over the top never works, but it does sometimes. So you can't say that it cannot work. The Steelers pretty much only build through the draft, they are in the conversation usually but they get beat by the pats just like everyone else, and right now they are imploding.

I think the point is that there is no one sure way to build a team. Think the Broncos regret signing those players? Or the Rams? Or the pats? We didn't win a Superbowl till that defense came together and Booger McFarlane (FA) solidified the interior of that D.

[Chromeburn]

Jags have released DT Malik Jackson, S Tashaun Gipson, RT Jermey Parnell, LS Carson Tinker and RB Carlos Hyde.

Trying to get enough cap space to sign Foles I imagine ???

They did re-sign ex-Colt long snapper Matt Overton :cool:

That's probably their upcoming draft. Ed Oliver at 7. A safety or tackle in the second. A RB in the third.

I would pass on Jackson. He wasn’t that great for them. Let Wade Phillips pick him up. He played great for Philips.

[Dam8610]

But the Jags have drafted well previously also. Jalen Ramsey is their best player, Myles Jack, Smith, Fournette, Ronnie Harrison I think will be good, etc. They were not just built through FA. Their biggest problem is not hitting on a QB and not handling success well. If they had drafted Derek Carr instead of Bortles they might have a Superbowl now. They should not have given Bortles that huge contract.

It would be one thing if signing FA's to push over the top never works, but it does sometimes. So you can't say that it cannot work. The Steelers pretty much only build through the draft, they are in the conversation usually but they get beat by the pats just like everyone else, and right now they are imploding.

I think the point is that there is no one sure way to build a team. Think the Broncos regret signing those players? Or the Rams? Or the pats? We didn't win a Superbowl till that defense came together and Booger McFarlane (FA) solidified the interior of that D.

McFarland was a trade. The biggest FA of the Polian era was Corey Simon, but he ended up with knee problems, which were IMO due to him letting himself get out of shape.

[Chaka]

So if they win the Superbowl, they still should not have done it?

That would mean it turned out well for them - but not necessarily that it was a smart move.

[Chromeburn]

That would mean it turned out well for them - but not necessarily that it was a smart move.

Sigh

Let me rephrase it. Would you, Chaka, send your team into cap hell for a few seasons in the future, if your window was about to close and you knew you could win a Superbowl.

Just a yes or no, would you do it? I'm asking what you would do.

[Chromeburn]

McFarland was a trade. The biggest FA of the Polian era was Corey Simon, but he ended up with knee problems, which were IMO due to him letting himself get out of shape.

Didn't Simon have some weird sickness? Yeah, they tried to address DT several ways. Quitcock, Moala. Finally took a trade to do it, so draft capital instead of straight up money.

[Luck4Reich]

Sigh

Let me rephrase it. Would you, Chaka, send your team into cap hell for a few seasons in the future, if your window was about to close and you knew you could win a Superbowl.

Just a yes or no, would you do it? I'm asking what you would do.

I'm not sure why this is hard to say yes to.... 31 teams every year dont Win the SB... quite a few Have NEVER won a SB. So hell yes... do what it takes to win one.

[Luck4Reich]

But the Jags have drafted well previously also. Jalen Ramsey is their best player, Myles Jack, Smith, Fournette, Ronnie Harrison I think will be good, etc. They were not just built through FA. Their biggest problem is not hitting on a QB and not handling success well. If they had drafted Derek Carr instead of Bortles they might have a Superbowl now. They should not have given Bortles that huge contract.

It would be one thing if signing FA's to push over the top never works, but it does sometimes. So you can't say that it cannot work. The Steelers pretty much only build through the draft, they are in the conversation usually but they get beat by the pats just like everyone else, and right now they are imploding.

I think the point is that there is no one sure way to build a team. Think the Broncos regret signing those players? Or the Rams? Or the pats? We didn't win a Superbowl till that defense came together and Booger McFarlane (FA) solidified the interior of that D.

If they had landed a competant QB. Would be speaking differently about them. Still hate em but they would have had a lot more success.

[VeveJones007]

That's probably their upcoming draft. Ed Oliver at 7. A safety or tackle in the second. A RB in the third.

I would pass on Jackson. He wasn’t that great for them. Let Wade Phillips pick him up. He played great for Philips.

I don’t think that’s the route they take. I think they add Foles and stock up on receiving options in Rd 1 & 2. Maybe Metcalf and one of Fant or Hockenson if they drop.

[Chromeburn]

If they had landed a competant QB. Would be speaking differently about them. Still hate em but they would have had a lot more success.

They are punks, except Cambell, I still get steamed of how Ramsey throat punched Hilton last season. But they are a dominant defense and kicked our ass last game. With Nick Foles and some proper leadership, they could be scary.

I don’t think that’s the route they take. I think they add Foles and stock up on receiving options in Rd 1 & 2. Maybe Metcalf and one of Fant or Hockenson if they drop.

That would be interesting. I thought about WR, but Fant or Hockenson and a WR. Depends what Coughlin thinks they need most. They did draft Bryan (DT) last year and Chalk (WR). Maybe a TE is what they need. Hockenson would be a good blocker and catcher for them.

[AlwaysSunnyinIndy]

McFarland was a trade. The biggest FA of the Polian era was Corey Simon, but he ended up with knee problems, which were IMO due to him letting himself get out of shape.


I would disagree that Corey Simon was the biggest FA signing of the Polian era. I think it was Adam Vinatieri.

Yes, I realize it is sad that the biggest FA signing over a 10+ year period of time was a PK, but AV is an extraordinary kicker. That free agent signing also let us renounce the idiot kicker.

[Butter]

I would pass on Jackson. He wasn’t that great for them. Let Wade Phillips pick him up. He played great for Philips.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D1KWdehW0AY8wW0.jpg

[Luck4Reich]

56 > 97

[AlwaysSunnyinIndy]

56 > 97


Although to be fair to Malik, there were many defensive players put into similar positions when going head-to-head with Big Q this past season. :D

[Racehorse]

Sigh

Let me rephrase it. Would you, Chaka, send your team into cap hell for a few seasons in the future, if your window was about to close and you knew you could win a Superbowl.

Just a yes or no, would you do it? I'm asking what you would do.

If the window is closing? Heck yeah!In our current situation? No way! I think PITT and NO should do what it takes, given their closing windows.

[smitty46953]

Although to be fair to Malik, there were many defensive players put into similar positions when going head-to-head with Big Q this past season. :D

Was fun to watch as well :cool:

[Chaka]

Sigh

Let me rephrase it. Would you, Chaka, send your team into cap hell for a few seasons in the future, if your window was about to close and you knew you could win a Superbowl.

Just a yes or no, would you do it? I'm asking what you would do.

Not a very realistic question, but okay. If the "window was about to close" and you want to take a final shot at it, then fine. But that's not where the Jaguars were, and that's not where the Colts are, so I fail to see what this has to do with anything.

I will always chose the chance for sustained excellence over an extended period, rather than blowing everything out for a one season shot at the Super Bowl. It sucks for the fans to go from a Super Bowl contender to having to cut your star players to keep under the cap, and it's just plain more fun to have along term winning organization. Good for the community, good for the players, good for the organization, and good for the fans.

[Chromeburn]

Not a very realistic question, but okay. If the "window was about to close" and you want to take a final shot at it, then fine. But that's not where the Jaguars were, and that's not where the Colts are, so I fail to see what this has to do with anything.

I will always chose the chance for sustained excellence over an extended period, rather than blowing everything out for a one season shot at the Super Bowl. It sucks for the fans to go from a Super Bowl contender to having to cut your star players to keep under the cap, and it's just plain more fun to have along term winning organization. Good for the community, good for the players, good for the organization, and good for the fans.

Relax, it was a hypothetical question. You’re so obsessed with the team going over the cap even though we have more cap space than actual cap spent. You don’t get any trophies for having the most money to spend.

[smitty46953]

You don’t get any trophies for having the most money to spend.

But, Jimmy Irsay gets a new guitar !!! :cool:

[Chaka]

Relax, it was a hypothetical question. You’re so obsessed with the team going over the cap even though we have more cap space than actual cap spent. You don’t get any trophies for having the most money to spend.

Nope, you aren't reading my posts very carefully - I just value smart money/roster management and long term planning. That often seems to go out the window in the early days of a free agency period. Look at what the Raiders are doing.

We will have plenty of players to pay big bucks to in a year or two and, although it might not be exciting or headline-grabbing, we need to lay the foundation for that now.

[Chromeburn]

But, Jimmy Irsay gets a new guitar !!! :cool:

Maybe some more beatnik poems. :rolleyes:

[Coltsalr]

The problem isn't with Irsay on this one. He let Grigson go on spending sprees on day one of free agency.

Ballard has a vision that's based on being conservative with this stuff. I hope it's a vision that I can't see, but right now, I'm definitely wondering about it.

[VeveJones007]

^^^

I was wrong. It isn't the takes that Deon Cain is a sure-fire WR2 that are going to kill me this offseason. It's the fans who can't listen when Ballard explicitly tells them what he's going to do.

[smitty46953]

^^^

I was wrong. It isn't the takes that Deon Cain is a sure-fire WR2 that are going to kill me this offseason. It's the fans who can't listen when Ballard explicitly tells them what he's going to do.

Deon Cain Rules !!! #spendthat$$$ :eek:

[Chromeburn]

Nope, you aren't reading my posts very carefully - I just value smart money/roster management and long term planning. That often seems to go out the window in the early days of a free agency period. Look at what the Raiders are doing.

We will have plenty of players to pay big bucks to in a year or two and, although it might not be exciting or headline-grabbing, we need to lay the foundation for that now.

Its nice if your team embraces long term building. Unfortunately, a lot of these teams turn over the coaches and GM's too much too soon, you are lucky if you get four years now. The Arizona coach got one year. It's win now or be fired for most of the league and it is reflected in everything from draft decisions to FA.

I'm not worried though, Ballard isn't going to do anything crazy. I doubt he breaks the bank for anything but a premier pass rusher.

But just because you have contracts coming up in a couple of years doesn't mean you can't find some guys to help in the short term. This team is in a window right now, if they get blown out again in the playoffs while still sitting on a pile of cash that is doing nothing, people are going to start grumbling. There is being fiscally responsible, then there is being negligent.

[rm1369]

^^^

I was wrong. It isn't the takes that Deon Cain is a sure-fire WR2 that are going to kill me this offseason. It's the fans who can't listen when Ballard explicitly tells them what he's going to do.

There’s a difference between not listening to what Ballard says and not agreeing with his approach. I hear Ballard and fully realize the Colts are taking the Ted Thompson GB Packers approach. I simply don’t like the idea of having an elite QB, sitting on $30m a year in cap space and coming up short every year.

[VeveJones007]

There’s a difference between not listening to what Ballard says and not agreeing with his approach. I hear Ballard and fully realize the Colts are taking the Ted Thompson GB Packers approach. I simply don’t like the idea of having an elite QB, sitting on $30m a year in cap space and coming up short every year.

But you understand that is the philosophy and that it can work? You would prefer to go another route, but you recognize that the Colts can win a championship without paying Landon Collins $14MM/year?

[Chromeburn]

The problem isn't with Irsay on this one. He let Grigson go on spending sprees on day one of free agency.

Ballard has a vision that's based on being conservative with this stuff. I hope it's a vision that I can't see, but right now, I'm definitely wondering about it.

They did that because Luck was on his rookie contract. Also, We did make it to the championship game, we have a banner for it :rolleyes:.

Grigson was fired because he couldn't draft... and because he was a dick.

I don't think anyone has a problem with Ballard's approach. Building through the draft is a good strategy and most good teams do it. As long as you are a good drafter.

But you can dabble in FA also. The Steelers have 20 million in cap space, The Eagles have 25, the Saints have 15, the pats have 20 million in cap space. The pats are very average drafters. You don't have to spend it all (and you shouldn't), but you should use some of it if you are in the hunt for a Superbowl.

[rm1369]

But you understand that is the philosophy and that it can work? You would prefer to go another route, but you recognize that the Colts can win a championship without paying Landon Collins $14MM/year?

I have no problem not paying Collins $14m. There is plenty of room between being the Skins and what Ballard seems to advocate. Can Ballard’s approach win a Super Bowl? Of course - he has an elite QB. Thompson won one as well with the super conservative approach and Rodgers. Do you think Thompson maximized the gift he had in Rodgers? I dont.

I fully get that you can’t solve every problem by throwing money at free agents. But I also know you can’t fill every hole on the roster through the draft. That everyone’s hopes at WR2 last year where pinned on a 6th round rookie was to me a failure. Grant was a place holder, not a solution. And Ballard knew it. You can tell by the contract. And it hurt in the playoffs. With an elite QB in his prime they shouldn’t be mortgaging the future for this year, but they shouldn’t be pushing every roster hole to next year’s draft either. There is middle ground there even if many don’t believe it.

[VeveJones007]

I have no problem not paying Collins $14m. There is plenty of room between being the Skins and what Ballard seems to advocate. Can Ballard’s approach win a Super Bowl? Of course - he has an elite QB. Thompson won one as well with the super conservative approach and Rodgers. Do you think Thompson maximized the gift he had in Rodgers? I dont.

I fully get that you can’t solve every problem by throwing money at free agents. But I also know you can’t fill every hole on the roster through the draft. That everyone’s hopes at WR2 last year where pinned on a 6th round rookie was to me a failure. Grant was a place holder, not a solution. And Ballard knew it. You can tell by the contract. And it hurt in the playoffs. With an elite QB in his prime they shouldn’t be mortgaging the future for this year, but they shouldn’t be pushing every roster hole to next year’s draft either. There is middle ground there even if many don’t believe it.

Then you understand Ballard’s “vision.” The poster I referenced didn’t comprehend a strategy that didn’t involve going hog wild in free agency.