Texans-Colts quick thoughts

[GoBigBlue88]

1. 100 percent the right call to go for it, just to get that out of the way. This is a 4-12 to 8-8 range football team. A tie does nothing for them or us. You play to win. That was the right call. Where Reich erred were not going for it the first time (bluffing, then calling TO then going for it) and the playcall itself, which couldn't have been less creative.

2. Andrew Luck couldn't have done anything else. Left it all on the field. I am so impressed with him. Don't know what else to say. Luck is not the issue at all.

3. IMO, Quenton Nelson and Marcus Johnson made the two biggest mistakes to cost the Colts the game. That's whatever for Johnson, who is a WR5 type guy. For Nelson, I remain in the camp that he'll never live up to #6 overall pick impact.

4. It's frankly inexcusable for the run game to be as bad as it is. I actually thought today was more on the interior line play and TEs than it was the OTs, at least when it came to the running game. There is no reason for the Colts to tally these putrid numbers in 2018. That's a failing of Ballard's so far, even if he's had his successes elsewhere.

5. That said, don't forget that Nyheim Hines continues to make plays for IND. People keep wanting to see Wilkins in the backfield, but I remain convinced Hines needs to be on the field at all times. Even when the Colts can't run, he's a weapon. Can't say the same about Wilkins.

6. Why can't Erik Swoope stay on this 53? Ryan Hewitt is patently awful in any area, and Mo Alie-Cox was just there today. This game was a really bad look from the TEs.

7. I don't have any illusions that Zach Pascal will be a real player for this team, but Pascal and Chester Rogers stepped up in the second half and played physical football. Colts BADLY need to upgrade at WR, but they got some good second half performances there today.

8. Can we officially say Ryan Kelly is a disappointment yet? I feel like he's benefitted from a bit of a tallest midget situation at center through the years.

9. Honestly, I don't have any major issues with the DL. I think Deshaun Watson is just SUCH a problem for defenses. You do have to stunt and mush rush him because you need to keep some element of contain. That doesn't lead to a lot of clean pass rush. I see what the DL was trying to do and don't really have many issues with their performance today.

10. Schematically, though, I have some issues with Eberflus' defense today. Eyeball test says today was almost exclusively Cover-2, where they've been mixing heavy Cover-1 and Cover-3 in weeks past. Their zone drops were just way too generous though. It's tough, because Watson is such a problem and you also usually have to dedicate a spy resource to him that can't drop deep in coverage. But still felt like Colts didn't quite get their inside drop depth right.

11. Thought this was a particularly bad game from the safeties. Malik Hooker is absolutely invisible in a Cover-2 defense; I think his skillset is totally wasted. Matthias Farley had a rough day, IMO, that had everything to do with angles and zones and nothing to do with his drop. Clayton Geathers was OK.

12. The Kenny Moore injury really hurt Indy. Chris Milton can't play in the base defense. Like, at all. We knew this last season.

13. For his standards, bit of a disappointing game from Darius Leonard. I get what they were trying to do by having him spy Watson, but I don't think he was very effective in doing so. I'd need a re-watch to really know, though.

14. Pretty crazy that the Colts really should have been beat by a bomb to DeAndre Watkins where, for the only time that day, it seemed like they were not playing a deep zone over top.

15. I think it's officially time to start asking questions about this team and hamstring injuries.

[Indiana V2]

Injuries are almost a bigger issue under this regime, than it was for Pagano's. Ridiculous.

[daedge]

Couldn't agree more with your first point.

[Indiana V2]

People keep saying they have no problem with the 4th down try, because we're not a playoff team. Why not?

As I said in the game thread, we blew a big lead to the Bengals. We beat Washington in DC. We had a good chance to win in Philly. We could have, and should have if it weren't for the 2 fumbles, won this game today. We aren't far off from possibly being undefeated, or at worst 3-1.

And we're freaking young, and missing key players due to injury, in theory, we should better as the season goes on. So why can't we be a playoff team?

[ukcolt]

Yep, absolutely the right call to go for it, a tie does nothing at all for us, might as well be a loss.

I too am really frustrated by our lack of ability to be able to get a consistent running game going. Saying that though we have played against some pretty good DL's to open the season....Bengals, Redskins, Eagles and Texans.

[njcoltfan]

People keep saying they have no problem with the 4th down try, because we're not a playoff team. Why not?

As I said in the game thread, we blew a big lead to the Bengals. We beat Washington in DC. We had a good chance to win in Philly. We could have, and should have if it weren't for the 2 fumbles, won this game today. We aren't far off from possibly being undefeated, or at worst 3-1.

And we're freaking young, and missing key players due to injury, in theory, we should better as the season goes on. So why can't we be a playoff team?
Lot of what if's, almost's and could of been's Truth is the Colts are 1-3 and tied for last in the division.

[Colts And Orioles]

People keep saying they have no problem with the 4th down try, because we're not a playoff team. Why not?

As I said in the game thread, we blew a big lead to the Bengals. We beat Washington in DC. We had a good chance to win in Philly. We could have, and should have if it weren't for the 2 fumbles, won this game today. We aren't far off from possibly being undefeated, or at worst 3-1.

And we're freaking young, and missing key players due to injury, in theory, we should better as the season goes on. So why can't we be a playoff team?




o


Yeah, I'd much rather be 1-2-1 than 1-3 this early in the season. If the Colts were 3-6 after 9 games, it would be pretty apparent that they are not a playoff team.......not at 1-2 after only 3 games, with both losses having gone right down to the wire.


The defense has had 4 either really good or pretty good games so far.

On the other side of the ball, this was by far Andrew Luck's best game of this still very young season.


With the defense playing as surprisingly well as they have been, and with Luck coming into his own in spite of the offensive line's troubles, I see no reason why Reich and the Colts should have necessarily written off the season after only 3 games, and give a game away instead of accepting a tie on such a risky decision.


o

[DragonTails]

[QUOTE=GoBigBlue88;83337]
3. IMO, Quenton Nelson and Marcus Johnson made the two biggest mistakes to cost the Colts the game. That's whatever for Johnson, who is a WR5 type guy. For Nelson, I remain in the camp that he'll never live up to #6 overall pick impact.

The 2 biggest mistakes were the bad snap and luck's fumble.

[Chromeburn]

I think we are a decent team and competitive. Not a great team though, we need a few more pieces and for the young guys to get more experience. Also, we need the early part of the schedule would be tough this year. Combined with new schemes and personnel. I expect us to have a better second half of the year. Another decent draft, some actual FA pickups, and I think we are on our way.

I was encouraged by the better pass blocking in the second half. I hope Nelson files that bitch slap away and uses it to fuel his next encounter with Clowney.

[daedge]

Reich on the 4th down call.

“I'm not playing to tie. I'll do that 10 times out of 10. That's just the way it's got to roll."

That's my kind of head coach.

Fuck ties.

[Chromeburn]

Reich on the 4th down call.

“I'm not playing to tie. I'll do that 10 times out of 10. That's just the way it's got to roll."

That's my kind of head coach.

Fuck ties.

I agree, fuck ties. Play to win.

[DragonTails]

I agree, fuck ties. Play to win.

They should have played to win last week instead of playing not to lose.

Way to conservative last week, imo.

[GoBigBlue88]

People keep saying they have no problem with the 4th down try, because we're not a playoff team. Why not?

As I said in the game thread, we blew a big lead to the Bengals. We beat Washington in DC. We had a good chance to win in Philly. We could have, and should have if it weren't for the 2 fumbles, won this game today. We aren't far off from possibly being undefeated, or at worst 3-1.

And we're freaking young, and missing key players due to injury, in theory, we should better as the season goes on. So why can't we be a playoff team?

I mean, by that logic, the Colts were a playoff caliber team last year. But the reality is: they're not a good team and needed Andrew Luck magic to elevate them to the possibility of winning this.

[YDFL Commish]

1. 1

3. IMO, Quenton Nelson and Marcus Johnson made the two biggest mistakes to cost the Colts the game. That's whatever for Johnson, who is a WR5 type guy. For Nelson, I remain in the camp that he'll never live up to #6 overall pick impact.

Can you elaborate on Nelson's big mistake?

If you're talking about the holding call...then no, that was a bad call. That was Nelson just stonewalling his man to the ground.

If you're talking about getting beat by Clowney...uh that's going to happen on occasion to even ab all pro guard. They ran a stunt, Nelson got caught a little to far inside and didn't anticipate Clowney's speed.

Nelson, was no more the problem than Luck was.

[GoBigBlue88]

Nelson, was no more the problem than Luck was.

This is an absurd statement. You're going out of your way to defend someone who A) gave up a key sack and B) did not have a good game.

[YDFL Commish]

This is an absurd statement. You're going out of your way to defend someone who A) gave up a key sack and B) did not have a good game.

No. Nelson didn't have a great game, but by no means was it a bad game. Luck's fumble and Kelly's bad snap were much bigger contributor's to this loss than anything Nelson did or didn't do.

Other than that fumble, yes...Luck was nearly flawless today.

[Racehorse]

Can you elaborate on Nelson's big mistake?

If you're talking about the holding call...then no, that was a bad call. That was Nelson just stonewalling his man to the ground.

If you're talking about getting beat by Clowney...uh that's going to happen on occasion to even ab all pro guard. They ran a stunt, Nelson got caught a little to far inside and didn't anticipate Clowney's speed.

Nelson, was no more the problem than Luck was.

I need to go back and watch it, because my son told me that Nelson was engaged with another player, but left to try to stop Clowney's stunt, but was too late.

[Colts And Orioles]

I mean, by that logic, the Colts were a playoff caliber team last year. But the reality is: they're not a good team, and needed Andrew Luck magic to elevate them to the possibility of winning this.




o


The defense has played unexpectedly well in this still young season, including today.

The offense gave 14 points to the Texans in regulation, and they also failed to take advantage of an INT by the defense with extremely questionable play calling on 2nd and 3rd downs immediately after said INT, which forced a punt.



If the offense had been more efficient (and less disastrous) in the first place, they would not have needed all of Luck's magic to make the monumental comeback which they made to force the overtime period.



o

[Maniac]

This is an absurd statement. You're going out of your way to defend someone who A) gave up a key sack and B) did not have a good game.

Just like you go out of your way every week to say you didn't like Ballard drafting him that high. We get it. Ballard isn't going to go back and redraft someone else, so quit harping on it every week. It's silly.

No overreaction on Luck's arm this week though, so hopefully that's enough of that.

[YDFL Commish]

I need to go back and watch it, because my son tolf me that Nelson was engaged with another player, but left to try to stop Clowney's stunt, but was too late.

Yes that is basically the gist of it.

[omahacolt]

Yes that is basically the gist of it.

That isn’t how I remember it. Could be though

[omahacolt]

1). Luck checked every box today

2). Autry had himself a game early. That was good to see

3). No running game again. Fix this Reich

4). I actually like Luck when he has to go away from Hilton and Doyle

5). Being down 2 tackles against the texicans is what it is. You had to expect that.

6). After the desir pick we had 2nd and 1 on their side. Ended up 4th and 7. Inexcusable

7. Got to watch the game with my brother. That was awesome.

8). Playing against the refs is hard.

9). Loved going for it

10). Zone coverage was a disaster much of the game. Safety play was shit.

11). Good post gbb

[Chaka]

3. IMO, Quenton Nelson and Marcus Johnson made the two biggest mistakes to cost the Colts the game. That's whatever for Johnson, who is a WR5 type guy. For Nelson, I remain in the camp that he'll never live up to #6 overall pick impact..

Here are the last ten 6th overall picks:

2008 - Vernon Gholston (LB) - Jets
2009 - Andre Smith (T) - Bengals
2010 - Russell Okung (T) - Seahawks
2011 - Julio Jones (WR) - Falcons
2012 - Morris Claiborne (CB) - Cowboys
2013 - Barkevious Mingo (OLB) - Browns
2014 - Jake Matthews (T) - Falcons
2015 - Leonard Williams (DT) - Jets
2016 - Ronnie Stanley (T) - Ravens
2017 - Jamal Adams (S) - Jets

He probably won't outplay Julio Jones, but I think when all is said and done Nelson will compare well with the above players' careers.

[omahacolt]

Here are the last ten 6th overall picks:

2008 - Vernon Gholston (LB) - Jets
2009 - Andre Smith (T) - Bengals
2010 - Russell Okung (T) - Seahawks
2011 - Julio Jones (WR) - Falcons
2012 - Morris Claiborne (CB) - Cowboys
2013 - Barkevious Mingo (OLB) - Browns
2014 - Jake Matthews (T) - Falcons
2015 - Leonard Williams (DT) - Jets
2016 - Ronnie Stanley (T) - Ravens
2017 - Jamal Adams (S) - Jets

He probably won't outplay Julio Jones, but I think when all is said and done Nelson will compare well with the above players' careers.okung was drafted in 2010? That is insane to me

[bertjones]

1). Luck checked every box today

2). Autry had himself a game early. That was good to see

3). No running game again. Fix this Reich

4). I actually like Luck when he has to go away from Hilton and Doyle

5). Being down 2 tackles against the texicans is what it is. You had to expect that.

6). After the desir pick we had 2nd and 1 on their side. Ended up 4th and 7. Inexcusable

7. Got to watch the game with my brother. That was awesome.

8). Playing against the refs is hard.

9). Loved going for it

10). Zone coverage was a disaster much of the game. Safety play was shit.

11). Good post gbb

I'm really tired of this team getting screwed over by officiating crews.
Somebody needs to make a statement and take the fine.

[Chromeburn]

Can you elaborate on Nelson's big mistake?

If you're talking about the holding call...then no, that was a bad call. That was Nelson just stonewalling his man to the ground.

If you're talking about getting beat by Clowney...uh that's going to happen on occasion to even ab all pro guard. They ran a stunt, Nelson got caught a little to far inside and didn't anticipate Clowney's speed.

Nelson, was no more the problem than Luck was.

More like he didn't anticipate Clowney's power bc he tossed him. But wasn't Clowney a number 1 pick, he was picked there for a reason. Not like Some scrub made him look bad. He did leave a double team to pick him up, Clowney had momentum, but I don't think Nelson anticipated his power enough.

[YDFL Commish]

More like he didn't anticipate Clowney's power bc he tossed him. But wasn't Clowney a number 1 pick, he was picked there for a reason. Not like Some scrub made him look bad. He did leave a double team to pick him up, Clowney had momentum, but I don't think Nelson anticipated his power enough.

The way I remember it, was Nelson was off balance to begin with, after he came off of the inside block.

Whether it was power or speed is really irrelevant.

Nelson was picked 6th and has made a huge improvement to the Colts O-Line. Just because it doesn't show in the final outcome doesn't make it so.

No AC and no Haeg, and this OL still played better than anytime in recent memory...before this season.

[Johanvil]

I'm really tired of this team getting screwed over by officiating crews.
Somebody needs to make a statement and take the fine.

Yesterday we had the missed delay call and last week that one.

Mike Chappell@mchappell51 Sep 24
Looking back at Colts loss at Philly. On endless 17-play, 75-yd go-ahead drive, Eagles converted 3rd and 9 with 10-yd to Agholor. Looked clear Agholor stepped out a 1-2-yd short before diving for FD.

[GoBigBlue88]

Let's be clear, and it's a tangent: Nelson was passing off a stunt and coming back to the DE (Clowney) looping inside. He didn't set and got obliterated. It was a costly play.

We can call a spade a spade: Nelson played poorly yesterday. Ostensibly, he was drafted to improve a nonexistent run game and sure up protection when the Colts face the Clowneys and Watts of the league. You can tell me if you think that has happened since he was drafted, and what that means.

[DrSpaceman]

There was plenty of blame to go around on this one today. Everywhere

How many dropped passes in the first half? I lost count. And then on the 4th down play, it happened so quick, not sure if it was dropped or a bad throw by Luck

Running an empty backfield shotgun out of your own end zone? Was it any surprise that turnover and TD happened? Just stupid.

On the other hand, Kelly, come on many, horrible mistake

OL, OL, OL, especially the tackles, just awful. I know he won't do it, but really, I wouldn't mind even a trade or something to find another at least right tackle. Or a left tackle. Pick one, Right now this team has neither. No idea who might be available, but the team is still being killed on the edge rush

Penalties, that holding call in OT was a killer.

Offensively, yet again a timely turnover just when you needed it and produce no points. And why was that? Three stupid play calls on 2nd, 3rd and 4th down.

Another Luck turnover deep. I know the D did not look great, but when turnovers basically give the other team 17 easy points off two offensive plays, you aren't going to win in this league.

The plus side, Luck looked good late, even without TY Hilton in there. Zach Pascal had the game of his life. A great comeback that again falls short.

Growing pains for a young team and young coach. We expected this. Its disappointing, but I can live with it for now.

If come Nov/Dec this team is still making these same mistakes, I will be very concerned.

Bad calls? yes. But that 0 play clock thing happens quite a bit, the refs give teams quite a bit of leeway it seems on getting the play off after even it hits zero.

Not as bad as Cleveland, got completely SCREWED on an overturned placement on 3rd down and had to punt, lose the game.

What does Frank Reich like for Father's Day?
Anything but a tie

[DrSpaceman]

Oh and my only problem with going for the win instead of the tie, if you ARE going to do that, be prepared to snap the ball and run the play the FIRST time you went out there, before the time out was called and just tried to draw them offsides

For one, you save the time out and second, much more of the element of surprise to the D because I doubt they though a play was being run or they were really going for it. The second time they came out, was obvious they were not punting. Do it the first time.

[DrSpaceman]

Reich on the 4th down call.

“I'm not playing to tie. I'll do that 10 times out of 10. That's just the way it's got to roll."

That's my kind of head coach.

Fuck ties.

I hear Reich's sister is very ugly.

[Maniac]

Let's be clear, and it's a tangent: Nelson was passing off a stunt and coming back to the DE (Clowney) looping inside. He didn't set and got obliterated. It was a costly play.

We can call a spade a spade: Nelson played poorly yesterday. Ostensibly, he was drafted to improve a nonexistent run game and sure up protection when the Colts face the Clowneys and Watts of the league. You can tell me if you think that has happened since he was drafted, and what that means.

You're just coming off as a bitter hater constantly ranting about Nelson and his draft position.

He has played very well for the most part. He is a rookie and is going to make some mistakes now and then, but overall, very good.

I'm sure you know that the offensive line has to play as a cohesive unit, and when you have backups at both tackle positions, any offensive line is going to struggle. I'm sure it's Nelson's fault that the tackle position has had a lot of injuries.

I'm sure you'll continue rambling on about how a guard doesn't impact a team enough. We know your position on this already. You've ranted about it over, and over, and over. It's a boring broken record at this point. At what point are you going to realize that your complaining isn't going to change the fact that he WAS drafted that high, so when are you going to stop being bitter and give up the weekly rants about it?

[rm1369]

I don’t have a huge issue with the decision to go for it in OT, but that’s only because I don’t believe the team is going anywhere this year. If I thought they would be in the playoff hunt then I’d be pissed. Aggressive is one thing, reckless is another.

The play Nelson got blew up by Clowney was bad. However, Clowney is a pretty damn good player and he gets paid to do this stuff too. Nelson isn’t going to win every snap, but maybe it will stop the “that’s why you draft Nelson at 6” posts that seem to be brought up when he makes a good block. No one play (good or bad) will define Nelson’s career or Ballard’s decision.

[HoosierinFL]

Can you elaborate on Nelson's big mistake?

If you're talking about the holding call...then no, that was a bad call. That was Nelson just stonewalling his man to the ground.

If you're talking about getting beat by Clowney...uh that's going to happen on occasion to even ab all pro guard. They ran a stunt, Nelson got caught a little to far inside and didn't anticipate Clowney's speed.

Nelson, was no more the problem than Luck was.

Seriously, he got caught off balance, it's not as if he got squared up against Clowney and then just lost. It was a mental mistake at most.

[rcubed]

I was good with going for it, but wish they would have the first time rahter then trying to get offsides. They were clearly anticipating the hard count, it would be been a small advantage to actually snap the ball on one of those counts.

Nice game by back up recievers.

They bad snap fumble in the endzone was terrible. The luck fumble was unfortunate but watt made a really nice play like he often does. Its hard to win with you basically gift the other team 14 points.

oh, and I like what I am seeing with hines!

[1965southpaw]

One team has broken a record for tackles for a loss (31) through 4 games, previously held by the 2015 Rams...........that's right. It's your 2018 colts defense.

Obviously we are still in a major rebuilding effort but there are serious reasons to be optimistic
1. Defense is ahead of schedule in their rebuild
2. The last bits of "rust" have fallen off Luck
3. Though we will lose games we could have won, they are still a hell of a lot more interesting to watch than the last 3 years.

I still predict 8 wins as the schedule gets easier and we will play better in the back half. Continued injuries in key positions is my biggest concern.

[1965southpaw]

17 sacks through the first 4 games......the most in Indy Colts history!!

[rcubed]

One team has broken a record for tackles for a loss (31) through 4 games, previously held by the 2015 Rams...........that's right. It's your 2018 colts defense.

Obviously we are still in a major rebuilding effort but there are serious reasons to be optimistic
1. Defense is ahead of schedule in their rebuild
2. The last bits of "rust" have fallen off Luck
3. Though we will lose games we could have won, they are still a hell of a lot more interesting to watch than the last 3 years.

I still predict 8 wins as the schedule gets easier and we will play better in the back half. Continued injuries in key positions is my biggest concern.
Yep. and a big highlite to #3. They are fun to watch again!

[Chromeburn]

Nelson sack is the 4th gif down

https://www.stampedeblue.com/2018/10/1/17923592/colts-vs-texans-breaking-down-the-drive-that-doomed-the-colts

Also on the last play they think Watt got a finger tip on the ball and altered the trajectory.

[DrSpaceman]

How about that intentional grounding call?

It didn't seem to matter in the end, but what a load of shit that was.

If that is grounding now, then any time the QB is under pressure and alters his throw as a result it would be grounding.

TY was WIDE open, I believe, there is no way he would have intentionally grounded that play

[GoBigBlue88]

How about that intentional grounding call?

It didn't seem to matter in the end, but what a load of shit that was.

If that is grounding now, then any time the QB is under pressure and alters his throw as a result it would be grounding.

TY was WIDE open, I believe, there is no way he would have intentionally grounded that play

That PISSED ME OFF. Jesus. The supposition there is that Luck intentionally threw it away with a wide open receiver? The NFL should have to openly apologize for bullshit like that.

[Spike]

That PISSED ME OFF. Jesus. The supposition there is that Luck intentionally threw it away with a wide open receiver? The NFL should have to openly apologize for bullshit like that.

Refs fucked the Browns too. Tired of those bastards determining the outcome of games. It could easily be fixed by having someone in the booth overturning these dumb ass calls. I don't understand the rule that some calls are not reviewable. And the refs need to swallow their whistles and let a play go, then review it. Fuck the apology, that does nothing for the team or the fans.

[Racehorse]

Nelson sack is the 4th gif down

https://www.stampedeblue.com/2018/10/1/17923592/colts-vs-texans-breaking-down-the-drive-that-doomed-the-colts

Also on the last play they think Watt got a finger tip on the ball and altered the trajectory.

Looks like the premise that he left one player to stop Clowney was correct.

[HoosierinFL]

Even if Watt didn't hit the ball or Luck's arm to alter the throw on that grounding call, Luck still had another defender tackling him at his legs, preventing him from stepping into the throw. So either way I don't see how it could be grounding if contact from a defensive player alters a throw. This would mean that anytime a defender hits a QBs arm as its moving forward, knocks the ball out and the ball travels just a few feet and hits the ground, not making it back to the line of scrimmage or in the vicinity of an eligible receiver, then it would be intentional grounding.