OL Comparison and Poll

[IndyNorm]

We haven't had a how good/bad is Ballard drag out for awhile, so I thought I'd post some quick cap numbers I put together showing how much Ballard fucked up with the OL this past offseason and how bad Nelson's contract could end up being if he continues to play like he did this year. (all dollar values are rounded to $M).

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/SqzeNYvbLky4C6uMsGpPrAp34-swD2HDgnIvBpKzOoibRw71KQuZKg-S4j9iiwTdOjTmkzNM5pDcvpYpZDbJiLBww9w-hu9UrpYv2477LY6C8qKYSbFmmrrf5E975nETJNElGx-paxlpo9XiJwcbB3j7u6ldinG5uXQmV3_sphgGCYJ2BPQaKE4Kj dgf5CS4lTjS-c2uaXulyDPZaQA9Iwiqxys8AF9vZdpaerqmD_tGAG_bdHwDFXF 5PUaRaz15cmXb0-oIkRJduFR76t8EP1zL27rqzW1KIIwxrjWqKGw_yWlIwAoDKJMi JOL7eaiGrhzj_0SuL5-GHTl_4d8tXHHxzC7alckYtsBglutn1cQEPJTFphFQQ53Hi6qSz xY-E8jCwr8euRbPilEwTiBYctHWeqhFVFxzDYii9HQulvqHPoIeU9 tc56Cw2UwQbfJ-B0PqsNFz2N3n-5ZrImcqjlhCiIckWEQC1zfuS9tnTox5G2k5ahtcFOCyS0JuS_q NQckYQ8eZLTbVZcvXTLtYQXf3OOWYiCOfmQHTIpHG98oIwvZEy SwQl8PaXAG2uvFDeGruYhkDrhPI-LYDt9IQhEqRkUXsmF4omRyvVirFKeLlnvB0Of4uZ9Pa00AHWl2 BwOJRnMl4_HUlJSdgSPRbnDIlGIguqwBDvwsQMJPfsstemkjwj b1R19nZPK33ZA57jSugu4hncoAPQ1Ckb2GkM_zDftaU0smXlGK 8tDMMTqO8uLHp1mOZD_sFxJiXfRWLHUVlKzNmuVoyUTrDxdQ14 VD6NUhtEjIojhkJEMbFIC5xVfJke2ACIiDSSSWC0-X1jFXvt3SmKdLnyO5-CIehG7J2klPp6GNDFiGbQl2EzLhEBbLCsBCmWuc1UL2afg45G7 ZAjfnNwTnqQNpu5MIj2nulBF5FZxBOjXyNiiuOnoLU=w804-h383-no?authuser=0

I know that there's plenty of nuance here that's not captured, but crazy that the '22 cap hit for Armstead, Glow, Reed, and Fisher (who was signed to replace an injured Armstead) is 2/3 that of Q and Pryor, that the total contract $s are the same, and that there are $7M in fewer total guaranteed dollars.

[YDFL Commish]

Q's play will improve when the play around him improves.

[Chromeburn]

Quentin’s play has already been improving this season. With a LT on a rookie contract it should offset his cap. If the cowboys can have all pros at the positions we can too.

Center will likely need to be replaced. Kelly is injured a lot now.

Pryor was a one year gamble that failed horribly. Reed didn’t want to sign here and Glow got a good deal from the giants. RG shouldn’t be that hard to fill. Also it didn’t help Kelly was hurt to start the year.

My biggest criticism of Ballard continues to be he doesn’t address needs quick enough or with enough redundancy. This time it got his coach fired. But I don’t think it’s fire-able offense especially since we build through the draft and he is one of the best in the league at drafting.

We are not a FA destination, especially with no QB. And we are not signing huge FAs to huge contracts like a big market team.

[IndyNorm]

Q's play will improve when the play around him improves.

Hope you're right, but I'm pretty sure I just watched Denico Autry once again plant Nelson flat on his ass and teabag him on the way to his 10th strip sack against the Colts this year.

[IndyNorm]

Quentin’s play has already been improving this season. With a LT on a rookie contract it should offset his cap. If the cowboys can have all pros at the positions we can too.

Yeah, I suppose the rookie LT contract does help. But paying a LG very high end LT money isn't a good thing, especially when said LG has vastly underperformed since being paid that much.

Center will likely need to be replaced. Kelly is injured a lot now.

It's not just the injuries. Kelly flat out sucks when he's healthy too. He's probably the worst starting OC in the league this year and possibly the worst OC in the league period (as evidenced when Pinter comes in and outplays him). Of course with our luck he'll probably get back to his former pro bowl level after moving on, but I don't think we can take that risk.


Pryor was a one year gamble that failed horribly. Reed didn’t want to sign here and Glow got a good deal from the giants. RG shouldn’t be that hard to fill. Also it didn’t help Kelly was hurt to start the year.

Some of the nuance I was talking about with Reed and Glow. I know Reed gave Minny a discount, but they're only paying him slightly over the vet minimum. Seems to be we could have outbid them pretty easily. You never know what happened behind the scenes though: my guess is Ballard pissed him off by low balling him.

Glow did get a good deal, but we could have matched without any problem.

As for Pryor - Hopefully Ballard learned a lesson that LT is one of the positions you can't fuck around with and hand the starting job to a low end talent reclamation project. Unless he's gone then hopefully he didn't learn that lesson.


My biggest criticism of Ballard continues to be he doesn’t address needs quick enough or with enough redundancy. This time it got his coach fired. But I don’t think it’s fire-able offense especially since we build through the draft and he is one of the best in the league at drafting.

We are not a FA destination, especially with no QB. And we are not signing huge FAs to huge contracts like a big market team.

Agree with your thoughts on Ballard. Year after year he banks on filling holes through the draft or with bottom end FAs and year after year we watch those holes get exposed all season long. He probably shouldn't be fired, but hopefully this shit storm of a season lights a fire under his ass to fill team needs with more urgency.

As for not being a FA destination I think Ballard's reputation has a lot to do with that. Agents know that Ballard is only going to offer low end and/or 1 year show me contracts, so they don't even bother to consider the Colts.

Aside from that, up until this year I don't think the Colts were looked down upon that much. Remember we had 2 QBs specifically request to be traded here in the offseason. Going fwd I agree with you. Dumpster fire of a team in a small market = no FA interest.

[Brylok]

Q's play will improve when the play around him improves.

"Q" is very overpaid and on the decline. Not necessarily his fault, but he's par for the overall course I reckon.

[apballin]

Nelson and Rainman

[Chromeburn]

Yeah, I suppose the rookie LT contract does help. But paying a LG very high end LT money isn't a good thing, especially when said LG has vastly underperformed since being paid that much.

If you could show me that money would go to a pro-bowl-level contributor in exchange I would say ok. But I'm ok with it. Especially since I suspect we are getting new C and RG soon. Nelson provides a pocket to step up into and that is valuable. Assuming the tackles are stable.

It's not just the injuries. Kelly flat out sucks when he's healthy too. He's probably the worst starting OC in the league this year and possibly the worst OC in the league period (as evidenced when Pinter comes in and outplays him). Of course with our luck he'll probably get back to his former pro bowl level after moving on, but I don't think we can take that risk.

I think he is hurt and has been playing hurt. It's unfortunate. I don't think Pinter is the answer.


Some of the nuance I was talking about with Reed and Glow. I know Reed gave Minny a discount, but they're only paying him slightly over the vet minimum. Seems to be we could have outbid them pretty easily. You never know what happened behind the scenes though: my guess is Ballard pissed him off by low balling him.

I thought there was interest on our side. But who knows.

Glow did get a good deal, but we could have matched without any problem.

As for Pryor - Hopefully Ballard learned a lesson that LT is one of the positions you can't fuck around with and hand the starting job to a low end talent reclamation project. Unless he's gone then hopefully he didn't learn that lesson.

We sign Glow then we likely don't sign Gilmore. So i don't know, pick your poison.

Pryor was the disaster of the season. Never seen a single lineman cost a HC his job. I'm not sure why he played so much either. He wasn't benched till Saturday took over. I doubt it was Ballard, if that was true Banagu and Isiah would be starting.

Agree with your thoughts on Ballard. Year after year he banks on filling holes through the draft or with bottom end FAs and year after year we watch those holes get exposed all season long. He probably shouldn't be fired, but hopefully this shit storm of a season lights a fire under his ass to fill team needs with more urgency.

Every single team has holes and teams try to exploit them. This is nothing unique to the Colts. The Eagles might be the most complete team and that will stop when 2nd contract time comes for their QB. But he does have to have a solid LT, hopefully, that is Raimann.

As for not being a FA destination I think Ballard's reputation has a lot to do with that. Agents know that Ballard is only going to offer low end and/or 1 year show me contracts, so they don't even bother to consider the Colts.

I agree with that mentality somewhat. Expensive FA's can be a huge resource suck. I wanted him to sign a DE a few years ago when we really needed one and had cap room. I think they talked to a few but got outbid. Half of those guys failed. I'm ok with no huge FA's. Polian largely ignored them too. And we get some pretty good contributions out of the guys he does sign. I feel like you do this when you really know you have a shot and need to push over the edge. We still need a QB first.

Aside from that, up until this year I don't think the Colts were looked down upon that much. Remember we had 2 QBs specifically request to be traded here in the offseason. Going fwd I agree with you. Dumpster fire of a team in a small market = no FA interest.

QB's see the talent on the roster and would like to work with it. Who wouldn't? But skill players want that spot settled first.

[YDFL Commish]

Remembering what a real O-Line looks like.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRpJIclqEDQ

[BCN#1]

We are not a FA destination, especially with no QB. And we are not signing huge FAs to huge contracts like a big market team.

Then again, the big money talks and all the other bullshit walks.... Curious to see who takes the big money to come join this current dumpster fire.

[Spike]

As for Pryor - Hopefully Ballard learned a lesson that LT is one of the positions you can't fuck around with and hand the starting job to a low end talent reclamation project. Unless he's gone then hopefully he didn't learn that lesson.


If Ballard didn't know that already, he was the wrong man for the job.

[IndyNorm]

If Ballard didn't know that already, he was the wrong man for the job.

You would think he would, but I'm not so sure he did. How else would we end up with Matt Pryor as our starting LT?